Bible Study Method and the Key to Hebrews with Rick Boyd

Dr. Rick Boys has dedicated his life to studying scripture. In today’s podcast he lays out the foundations of a methodical approach to bible study and gives an example of that method with his own study of the book of Hebrews. I enjoy this conversation with Rick and think you will too.

Youtube - https://youtu.be/FGJUIvxHY_Q

Audio - https://andymilleriii.com/media/podcast

Apple -  https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/more-to-the-story-with-dr-andy-miller/id1569988895?uo=4

Click here to check out my Contender Course and Heaven Course! Find out more here - courses.andymilleriii.com

And don’t forget about my book that came out last summer, Contender, which is available on Amazon!

Five Steps to Deeper Teaching and Preaching - Recently, I updated this PDF document and added a 45-minute teaching video with slides, explaining this tool. It's like a mini-course. If you sign up for my list, I will send this free resource to you. Sign up here - www.AndyMillerIII.com or Five Steps to Deeper Teaching and Preaching.

Today’s episode is brought to you by these two sponsors:

Keith Waters and his team at WPO Development do an amazing job helping non-profits and churches through mission planning studies, strategic plans, feasibility studies, and capital campaigns. We are honored to have Keith and WPO on the More to the Story team. You can find out more about them at www.wpodevelopment.com or touch base directly with Keith at Keith.Waters@wpodevelopment.com.

AND

Wesley Biblical Seminary - Interested in going deeper in your faith? Check out our certificate programs, B.A., M.A.s, M.Div., and D.Min degrees. You will study with world-class faculty and the most racially diverse student body in the country. www.wbs.edu

Thanks too to Phil Laeger for my podcast music. You can find out about Phil's music at https://www.laeger.net

Transcript

Welcome to the more to story. Podcast I'm so glad that you have come along for this important episode of one of the most significant concepts in the New Testament that, I think, is often overlooked. And we're going to hear more about that in just a second. But first, I want you to know this. Podcast, comes to you from Wesley Biblical Seminary, where we are developing trusted leaders for faithful churches.

5
00:01:56.800 --> 00:02:13.310
Andy Miller III: and this is a time where you might be able to get in and sign up for classes or audit classes that are going to be happening in this summertime, but also, as we head into the fall semester, we're in an exciting time in the history of Wesley Biblical Seminary, where we've added more than 300 global Methodist church pastors

6
00:02:13.310 --> 00:02:27.370
Andy Miller III: as students in addition to other students. So this is a high point in our history. At the same time, there's just a host of programs that are available for people from bachelors to master's and doctoral degrees, but also a lay initiative. The Wesley Institute is coming up

7
00:02:27.370 --> 00:02:37.489
Andy Miller III: this August, and we'd love for you to sign up for that or just learn more about us at Wbs. Edu also this, podcast is brought to you by Wpo development.

8
00:02:37.490 --> 00:02:44.679
Andy Miller III: They are a consulting firm that comes alongside, nonprofits, either schools, churches.

9
00:02:44.973 --> 00:03:08.140
Andy Miller III: other just kind of like charitable, charitable organizations and helps them think about their future, you know, and also then figure out how to actualize that future. And they do that through mission planning studies, feasibility sales and capital campaigns. If you're looking for some type of service like that, I highly recommend them to you because I've used them in the past, and they've been a blessing to me. So you can find out more about Wpo development

10
00:03:08.170 --> 00:03:09.459
Andy Miller III: in our show notes.

11
00:03:09.480 --> 00:03:36.740
Andy Miller III: Also, I want people to know that I would love for you to sign up for my email list. And you can do that. Andy Miller, the third.com. That's Andy Miller iii.com. And if you sign up for my email list I'll send you a free tool called 5 steps to deeper teaching and preaching. And it's it's a simple tool that guides you through the inductive Bible study method in a way that helps you keep in mind your congregation or the class that you're serving

12
00:03:36.971 --> 00:03:42.299
Andy Miller III: in the process. So I'd love for you to check that out. I also includes a 45 min video of me teaching

13
00:03:42.300 --> 00:04:07.119
Andy Miller III: on that topic. So you can check that out at Andy Miller, third.com. I also have some courses available there for small groups and Sunday school classes, one that's a discussion of the afterlife, and another one that works through the small book of Jude. Those are video based lessons that have discussion guides and something that churches and small groups are using. Actually, I just heard from a group from Australia just recently about it. And I heard from somebody, Ohio just yesterday

14
00:04:07.200 --> 00:04:15.440
Andy Miller III: who's using the Jude study. So if you're looking for something like that, you can find that at Andy Miller, the third is Andy Miller Iii. Com.

15
00:04:16.089 --> 00:04:34.419
Andy Miller III: Okay, I am delighted to bring to you one of my friends. Now I I say, a lot of my podcast guests are friends. But this is really the case here with my friend, Dr. Rick Boyd, who serves as Professor of Inductive Bible Study and New Testament Professor at Wesley, Biblical Seminary, Rick Welcome to the Podcast.

16
00:04:34.420 --> 00:04:35.540
Rick Boyd: Thank you, brother.

17
00:04:35.620 --> 00:04:36.639
Rick Boyd: thank you. Just.

18
00:04:36.640 --> 00:04:40.280
Andy Miller III: It's good to have you on, brother, and we're gonna talk about that word even more

19
00:04:40.830 --> 00:05:04.040
Andy Miller III: this through this session. And I have to admit, Rick. I I think I noticed maybe our first conversation that you often refer to brothers and sisters in Christ with that title, and I didn't know I I figured it was important. I I think some people use that language. I didn't realize how much that was a part of the way you think about.

20
00:05:04.040 --> 00:05:20.999
Andy Miller III: Well, I'm going to say all of reality, like all of social reality through that lens, I mean. So we're going to get into that in this session. But, Rick, before we get going, before we get going and talking, we want to talk about Hebrews, and and Dr. Boyd has spent his

21
00:05:21.320 --> 00:05:39.950
Andy Miller III: scholarly life, studying the book of Hebrews, and I'm looking forward to my audience learning more about Hebrews in this session in this time together. But before we get that, Rick. Just tell us a little bit about yourself, and how you came to this position in your life where you're serving as a teacher of Scripture and training pastors, and that type of thing.

22
00:05:40.340 --> 00:05:46.499
Rick Boyd: I I could never have imagined it. I I was not, you know, brought up in a Christian household.

23
00:05:46.954 --> 00:05:55.100
Rick Boyd: My parents used to be bothered by that when they would hear me over the last. You know, 20 years or so talk.

24
00:05:55.220 --> 00:05:59.139
Rick Boyd: and I would mention that they would say, This is a Christian household, but

25
00:05:59.300 --> 00:06:07.119
Rick Boyd: it wasn't. It was a moral household based on their standards. But I spent. I lived the first 31 years of my life

26
00:06:07.480 --> 00:06:21.378
Rick Boyd: outside the Church no relationship with the Lord whatsoever. I considered myself a default. Christian, just because it was at that time, you know, you're talking about the 60 seventies. Eighties was considered a Christian nation.

27
00:06:22.170 --> 00:06:26.700
Rick Boyd: but it wasn't. And in any case, when I was 31,

28
00:06:26.820 --> 00:06:29.010
Rick Boyd: after a series of

29
00:06:29.520 --> 00:06:40.320
Rick Boyd: incidents of idolatry. I was the chief idolator. I mean to follow Paul. I was the chief of centers. I was the chief idolator. I had as an idol

30
00:06:40.410 --> 00:06:41.600
Rick Boyd: radio.

31
00:06:41.780 --> 00:06:43.260
Rick Boyd: and you'll notice.

32
00:06:43.490 --> 00:06:44.140
Andy Miller III: Yes.

33
00:06:44.140 --> 00:07:00.199
Rick Boyd: I I'm used to the headphones. You you kind of make fun of me with the the helic helicopter, with the helicopter, and it does. It kind of looks like operating a helicopter. But I'm used to the headphones, cause I was in radio in the late seventies and into the eighties.

34
00:07:00.310 --> 00:07:04.269
Rick Boyd: and it was an idle to me. I worshipped it. And then

35
00:07:05.420 --> 00:07:08.009
Rick Boyd: basically the Lord God.

36
00:07:08.560 --> 00:07:10.379
Rick Boyd: the God of the Bible

37
00:07:11.012 --> 00:07:15.259
Rick Boyd: allowed me to meet my little G idle god

38
00:07:15.390 --> 00:07:22.129
Rick Boyd: of radio, and showed me that it's not what I thought it was. It's not worth worship.

39
00:07:22.656 --> 00:07:25.829
Rick Boyd: So I switched my allegiance from that idle

40
00:07:26.020 --> 00:07:27.460
Rick Boyd: to softball

41
00:07:27.580 --> 00:07:33.050
Rick Boyd: and softball, became this idle, and it was everything to me. And I was gonna win a state championship

42
00:07:33.566 --> 00:07:36.580
Rick Boyd: so I thought, well, in 1991,

43
00:07:36.870 --> 00:07:39.939
Rick Boyd: our team came out of Nowhere State of Illinois.

44
00:07:40.300 --> 00:07:43.619
Rick Boyd: and we won the Asa class, a State championship.

45
00:07:43.710 --> 00:07:47.629
Rick Boyd: To the surprise of everybody except the the people on the team

46
00:07:48.010 --> 00:07:52.360
Rick Boyd: because we we were confident in ourselves, but nobody else was well

47
00:07:52.570 --> 00:07:58.929
Rick Boyd: when we won the State championship. That was my second idol, and I had devoted my whole life to it at that point.

48
00:07:59.100 --> 00:08:08.220
Rick Boyd: and I have it. And once again God showed me it wasn't worth my life. It's it's an idle. So those 2 idols back to back

49
00:08:08.610 --> 00:08:10.630
Rick Boyd: sent me on a journey

50
00:08:10.880 --> 00:08:25.459
Rick Boyd: that 3 months later I was in a hotel room in Albuquerque, New Mexico working as an engineer. I'd gotten an engineering degree. After after I left radio, I redirected myself to engineering, but I played softball, and that was my life.

51
00:08:25.460 --> 00:08:26.230
Andy Miller III: Okay.

52
00:08:26.230 --> 00:08:30.469
Rick Boyd: So I'm working as an engineer visiting Albuquerque. I'm

53
00:08:30.500 --> 00:08:36.489
Rick Boyd: in a hotel room with 4 Seasons hotel room 204. At about 2 o'clock in the afternoon.

54
00:08:36.530 --> 00:08:38.519
Rick Boyd: and I'm reading Genesis.

55
00:08:38.700 --> 00:08:58.180
Rick Boyd: and 35 to Genesis. 35, 2, Jacob said to his household, and to all who are with him. Get rid of the foreign gods that are in your midst, and purify yourselves and change your clothes. And when I read that verse, and it was a life application Bible I had just bought.

56
00:08:58.710 --> 00:09:02.030
Rick Boyd: because I thought, well, I need something else to pursue.

57
00:09:02.270 --> 00:09:09.019
Rick Boyd: You know these 2 failed idolatries. How about just reading the Bible. Let's let maybe that has some answers.

58
00:09:09.130 --> 00:09:11.909
Rick Boyd: So I'm reading the application note for that verse.

59
00:09:12.700 --> 00:09:24.690
Rick Boyd: Application note said that an idle can be. It doesn't have to be a physical object. It can be a thought, or a desire, or anything that takes the place of God and brother. When I read that

60
00:09:24.810 --> 00:09:31.019
Rick Boyd: I was born again in an instant more radically than Saul, on the road to Damascus.

61
00:09:31.020 --> 00:09:31.640
Andy Miller III: Wow!

62
00:09:31.640 --> 00:09:34.809
Rick Boyd: Because Saul had background. I didn't have any background.

63
00:09:34.810 --> 00:09:35.370
Andy Miller III: Wow!

64
00:09:35.650 --> 00:09:38.859
Rick Boyd: And so I knew God was real.

65
00:09:38.960 --> 00:09:41.000
Rick Boyd: His presence filled the room.

66
00:09:41.560 --> 00:09:44.099
Rick Boyd: I knew that the Bible was his word.

67
00:09:44.510 --> 00:09:47.309
Rick Boyd: and I knew I was forever changed.

68
00:09:47.640 --> 00:09:50.999
Rick Boyd: And so this is, you know you made reference to the brother

69
00:09:51.310 --> 00:10:05.549
Rick Boyd: it became a very real thing. I was truly born again. I called my wife Jodie. We've been married for 2 years. She was back in Illinois, and I was in Albuquerque, and I said, we need to go to church. And she literally said, Who is this.

70
00:10:05.780 --> 00:10:06.730
Andy Miller III: Wow, because.

71
00:10:06.730 --> 00:10:11.080
Rick Boyd: It was not the same man that left that morning out of Willard Airport in Urbana

72
00:10:11.330 --> 00:10:15.919
Rick Boyd: to fly to Albuquerque, and so that changed everything for me

73
00:10:16.291 --> 00:10:22.070
Rick Boyd: and for for the next 2 and a half years I worked as an engineer, but now I'm on fire for the Lord.

74
00:10:22.370 --> 00:10:23.989
Rick Boyd: and what God did

75
00:10:24.220 --> 00:10:27.229
Rick Boyd: was, he took my most recent idle.

76
00:10:27.250 --> 00:10:28.519
Rick Boyd: which was softball

77
00:10:28.670 --> 00:10:30.820
Rick Boyd: and turned it into ministry.

78
00:10:31.160 --> 00:10:32.859
Rick Boyd: He is so good to do that.

79
00:10:33.180 --> 00:10:41.020
Rick Boyd: And so I played for that team, that championship team for another couple years. But they got kind of tired of the guy who's always referencing Christ

80
00:10:41.840 --> 00:10:50.659
Rick Boyd: and glorifying him. And all of this, and and so it ended up being a ministry. I coached the church team. Jodi and I were going to Free Methodist Church.

81
00:10:50.910 --> 00:10:53.290
Rick Boyd: and and at that point

82
00:10:53.610 --> 00:11:03.059
Rick Boyd: God called me to seminary, so Jody and I didn't. That's a whole nother story. Jody wasn't going, and God changed her heart at Estes Chapel

83
00:11:03.270 --> 00:11:06.499
Rick Boyd: on the campus at of Asbury Seminary.

84
00:11:06.580 --> 00:11:10.250
Rick Boyd: and so he called us to to Wilmore.

85
00:11:10.560 --> 00:11:28.659
Rick Boyd: and I was there from 94 to 97, not knowing where I was going to go from there just knowing that God called me to study His word. So I so I studied inductive Bible study that that particular method, and Greek and Hebrew. That was the emphasis of my time, not knowing where God's gonna call.

86
00:11:28.740 --> 00:11:32.549
Rick Boyd: And in 97 my last semester God

87
00:11:32.660 --> 00:11:35.180
Rick Boyd: called me to Christian radio.

88
00:11:35.620 --> 00:11:36.020
Andy Miller III: Now it.

89
00:11:36.020 --> 00:11:40.169
Rick Boyd: Wasn't my intention to redeem my radio deals.

90
00:11:40.170 --> 00:11:44.689
Andy Miller III: Yeah, you had the idols before then that like softball was used.

91
00:11:44.790 --> 00:11:57.980
Andy Miller III: And then, now you're in the situation. Where, hey? You had this experience in radio and and very successful, I mean in radio as well. So now I wanted to highlight one thing because you and I have had this conversation even today.

92
00:11:58.060 --> 00:12:04.989
Andy Miller III: Not we're not thinking about the nature of this call. But we were talking about the importance of calling

93
00:12:05.100 --> 00:12:13.799
Andy Miller III: even for seminary students as opposed to people coming because they need a credential. So they can get a job.

94
00:12:14.158 --> 00:12:40.349
Andy Miller III: And it seems like a lot. You you weren't at seminary because oh, this is why I need to get into Free Methodist Church. Now God use you in the Free Methodist Church. You've been actively engaged in various churches, but that wasn't why you were there right. It was purely because you knew that the god was calling you there. And so this similar direction came at at this point when you're finishing at Seminary to head towards Christian radio. Is that the case.

95
00:12:40.350 --> 00:12:47.980
Rick Boyd: Yeah, God's. It's funny how God calls people at least me. In my case I was born again reading the word.

96
00:12:47.990 --> 00:12:53.890
Rick Boyd: and in 1,994. I took a week off of work. I took my engineering job and kind of put it on hold.

97
00:12:53.930 --> 00:12:56.650
Rick Boyd: spent a week working through Ezekiel

98
00:12:56.850 --> 00:13:00.740
Rick Boyd: because I sense through Ezekiel. He was going to call me to something.

99
00:13:01.065 --> 00:13:06.210
Rick Boyd: and at the end of the week, that week off that I had. I was disappointed because Scott hadn't called me

100
00:13:06.460 --> 00:13:15.359
Rick Boyd: and I I. We were supposed to go to dinner with another couple. Jody wasn't ready, so I went back to my study, and I opened up Ezekiel again. Chapter 3.

101
00:13:15.390 --> 00:13:20.680
Rick Boyd: Son of man, eat what is before you eat this scroll and go speak to my house, Israel.

102
00:13:20.730 --> 00:13:23.540
Rick Boyd: and I knew in a moment

103
00:13:23.910 --> 00:13:28.629
Rick Boyd: that God was calling me to study His word. Now I didn't know exactly what that meant.

104
00:13:28.720 --> 00:13:34.449
Rick Boyd: It took another couple months of discernment to find out I didn't need to go to a Bible college.

105
00:13:34.550 --> 00:13:37.220
Rick Boyd: I've already got a bachelor degree in engineering.

106
00:13:37.260 --> 00:13:50.849
Rick Boyd: You can just go to seminary, and God called us to Asbury to study his word. And that's what I focused on, so that in 97 I'm standing outside A Bf Fisher library talking to another brother.

107
00:13:51.130 --> 00:13:54.649
Rick Boyd: and he brought to mind Jeff Moore in the distance, so.

108
00:13:54.650 --> 00:13:55.330
Andy Miller III: Yeah.

109
00:13:55.840 --> 00:13:58.329
Rick Boyd: When all is said and done, was the song.

110
00:13:58.410 --> 00:13:59.540
Rick Boyd: and

111
00:14:00.090 --> 00:14:04.030
Rick Boyd: and for some reason God gave me a vision

112
00:14:04.190 --> 00:14:07.700
Rick Boyd: for Christian radio which I'd never heard before.

113
00:14:08.104 --> 00:14:17.459
Rick Boyd: I had been in secular radio for 8 years, but I had left that behind, and so God gave me a specific vision of intertwining

114
00:14:17.850 --> 00:14:19.760
Rick Boyd: contemporary Christian music

115
00:14:20.410 --> 00:14:28.660
Rick Boyd: with depth of Scripture. Not just a verse of the day, not just a thought, a pleasant thought, something encouraging and positive.

116
00:14:28.660 --> 00:14:35.399
Andy Miller III: Positive uplifting, you know, like, Caleb, yeah, or whatever the whatever the station is like, safe for the whole family.

117
00:14:35.400 --> 00:14:35.870
Rick Boyd: Exact.

118
00:14:35.870 --> 00:14:56.400
Andy Miller III: Not a bad idea. I mean, I like safe things for my family. Don't get me wrong. I like safety, but I think sadly. It seems like much of Christian radio has become overly commercialized. And it's trying to, you know. Get to this this point of like, what has become the top station like what is what's going to be listened to the most so we can sell.

119
00:14:57.148 --> 00:15:00.870
Andy Miller III: Adds add time. Probably so. But you had a different idea.

120
00:15:00.870 --> 00:15:07.485
Rick Boyd: Well, it's it's what God gave me, you know he just. He implanted this in me, and and I could try and unpack that. But.

121
00:15:07.750 --> 00:15:09.919
Andy Miller III: Yeah, yeah, I wanna get the Hebrews. Yeah, yeah.

122
00:15:09.920 --> 00:15:22.939
Rick Boyd: And so he, he very, very, very, very clearly called me to Christian radio, and through a couple of months of discernment, and sending out letters to Christian radio stations, and all of that.

123
00:15:23.070 --> 00:15:27.009
Rick Boyd: There was a ministry in Minnesota, Southern Minnesota

124
00:15:27.030 --> 00:15:32.180
Rick Boyd: that was looking for precisely what God called me to do, and it was the only one in the nation

125
00:15:32.310 --> 00:15:34.300
Rick Boyd: that was interested in that.

126
00:15:34.520 --> 00:15:41.600
Rick Boyd: They flew us up there. Jody and I, both in our time up there knew that God was calling us up there.

127
00:15:42.280 --> 00:15:46.260
Rick Boyd: And so we moved up to Blue Earth, Minnesota, in 1997.

128
00:15:46.470 --> 00:15:51.449
Rick Boyd: And and I did Christian radio this this particular vision. Not just my program.

129
00:15:51.790 --> 00:15:55.549
Rick Boyd: but the whole I mean I was the program director, and then

130
00:15:55.996 --> 00:16:01.229
Rick Boyd: planted a church or not planted a church. Sorry I

131
00:16:01.290 --> 00:16:02.389
Rick Boyd: I was

132
00:16:02.710 --> 00:16:07.279
Rick Boyd: the operations manager of of a radio station that started

133
00:16:07.640 --> 00:16:11.369
Rick Boyd: September thirteenth of night, of 2,001.

134
00:16:11.580 --> 00:16:12.210
Andy Miller III: Okay.

135
00:16:12.420 --> 00:16:14.170
Rick Boyd: 2 days after 9, 11.

136
00:16:14.440 --> 00:16:15.399
Andy Miller III: Wow! I didn't.

137
00:16:15.400 --> 00:16:18.049
Rick Boyd: And it, and it was listener supported.

138
00:16:19.200 --> 00:16:21.569
Rick Boyd: Now that would be a challenge.

139
00:16:21.840 --> 00:16:23.000
Rick Boyd: But God.

140
00:16:24.306 --> 00:16:24.939
Rick Boyd: because

141
00:16:25.180 --> 00:16:29.550
Rick Boyd: September eleventh happens 2 days later. We're signing on the air for the first time.

142
00:16:29.660 --> 00:16:33.650
Rick Boyd: and we're depending on giving while all this giving was going out East.

143
00:16:34.060 --> 00:16:38.540
Rick Boyd: And so how are we gonna be funded? How are we gonna possibly continue?

144
00:16:38.730 --> 00:16:46.900
Rick Boyd: Well, the Lord provided I mean year after year after year our our income went up. The giving went up.

145
00:16:47.410 --> 00:16:50.290
Rick Boyd: So anyway, in 2,005.

146
00:16:50.410 --> 00:16:53.249
Rick Boyd: So I've been with this radio ministry for 8 years.

147
00:16:53.660 --> 00:16:56.529
Rick Boyd: and it's by the way, it's kinship Christian radio

148
00:16:56.540 --> 00:16:58.620
Rick Boyd: in Southern Minnesota, Northern Iowa.

149
00:16:58.640 --> 00:17:00.879
Rick Boyd: and God called me

150
00:17:01.000 --> 00:17:03.329
Rick Boyd: to back to school

151
00:17:03.390 --> 00:17:04.800
Rick Boyd: for a Ph. D.

152
00:17:05.030 --> 00:17:07.450
Rick Boyd: And that again is another story.

153
00:17:07.550 --> 00:17:11.420
Rick Boyd: But I knew that he was calling me back to study Hebrews.

154
00:17:13.250 --> 00:17:19.999
Rick Boyd: The the question that I had when I went to Seminary the first time I wanted to know what the New Testament authors.

155
00:17:20.260 --> 00:17:22.989
Rick Boyd: how they came to the conclusion

156
00:17:23.200 --> 00:17:31.449
Rick Boyd: that Jesus is the fulfillment of Scripture. How did they come to that conclusion? And I shared that with a

157
00:17:31.931 --> 00:17:35.449
Rick Boyd: a a familiar name to both of us. David Bauer.

158
00:17:35.450 --> 00:17:35.960
Andy Miller III: Yes, he!

159
00:17:35.960 --> 00:17:40.029
Rick Boyd: And he was my advisor in my master's master's work.

160
00:17:40.050 --> 00:17:42.360
Rick Boyd: He also became my doctoral advisor.

161
00:17:42.470 --> 00:17:48.839
Rick Boyd: but I shared that with him, and he said. You know, if you're really interested in that, you ought to look at the Book of Hebrews.

162
00:17:49.440 --> 00:17:59.459
Rick Boyd: Well, that his seed had been planted, and so I knew God was calling me to study Hebrews, and I did that, and was in Wilmore until 2,014,

163
00:17:59.930 --> 00:18:02.720
Rick Boyd: when, having studied

164
00:18:02.950 --> 00:18:07.059
Rick Boyd: inductive Bible study and Greek and Hebrew. That was my area.

165
00:18:07.360 --> 00:18:10.070
Rick Boyd: The languages and Ibs

166
00:18:10.891 --> 00:18:15.460
Rick Boyd: Wesley Biblical Seminary had a very specific need.

167
00:18:16.006 --> 00:18:20.639
Rick Boyd: They needed somebody to come in. Who was Ibs in the background

168
00:18:20.660 --> 00:18:23.500
Rick Boyd: with Greek and Hebrew capabilities.

169
00:18:24.400 --> 00:18:28.089
Rick Boyd: I mean, I didn't plan it that way, but apparently God did.

170
00:18:28.690 --> 00:18:36.290
Rick Boyd: And so we came down for the interview. Wesley hired us, and we moved here 10 years ago.

171
00:18:36.310 --> 00:18:40.839
Rick Boyd: And that's how we end up here, and that so my background is really Biblical studies.

172
00:18:40.910 --> 00:18:43.879
Rick Boyd: and you know Greek and Hebrew, and and that kind of stuff

173
00:18:43.950 --> 00:18:47.179
Rick Boyd: that I didn't plan. God did. And that's how we end up here.

174
00:18:47.390 --> 00:19:15.689
Andy Miller III: Well, it's great. I'm gonna see what I can do here to let people. Maybe you haven't heard us describe this method inductive Bible study and E, even if you've listened to the beginning, as I make my announce every time about the 5 steps to deeper teaching and preaching. Well, that's the inductive Bible study method. And this is a kind of a a streamlined version that I offer in that little tool that I give the people who sign for my email list. But the inductive Bible study method is something that we at Wesley Bible Seminary use

175
00:19:15.690 --> 00:19:33.010
Andy Miller III: as a way to approach Scripture. It is a method. It's an entire hermeneutical approach. I mean how we come to a place of seeing that Scripture or anything. I mean. You can use the the method in many areas, but particularly as it relates to Scripture how there is meaning in the text.

176
00:19:33.140 --> 00:19:57.550
Andy Miller III: And so if you come to Wesley Biblical Seminary, this is going to be at the heart of our curriculum, and it's not that we don't use other literary methods to be able to look at Scripture, or we don't look at outside source or the interpretation of others. But we have a process by which we move through

177
00:19:57.580 --> 00:20:20.319
Andy Miller III: the the meaning of the text. And so this is really at the heart. And, Rick, maybe I could. Here, I'm saying it in front of the master, so to speak. Anything else you wanna say about Ibs? Because that's really behind our even our discussion of Hebrews is that you inductively move through Hebrews to highlight a specific theme. But anything you like to say about? I'm sure there is.

178
00:20:20.320 --> 00:20:21.150
Rick Boyd: Anything more.

179
00:20:21.150 --> 00:20:22.840
Andy Miller III: You'd like to say about Ivs.

180
00:20:22.840 --> 00:20:27.370
Rick Boyd: Yeah, there, there actually is. And it comes down to where you start.

181
00:20:27.420 --> 00:20:32.149
Rick Boyd: Where do you? Where do you start in the process of studying the Bible

182
00:20:32.930 --> 00:20:48.570
Rick Boyd: and some methods they start with the history. Well, let's find out all we can about first century Judaism and first century Greco Roman culture, or you know, let's let's go to the experts and start with them and their thoughts on it.

183
00:20:48.830 --> 00:20:51.850
Rick Boyd: IBS. Starts with the text itself.

184
00:20:52.550 --> 00:21:08.310
Rick Boyd: and the emphasis on inductive Bible study is the final form of the text. I'm looking around my study here, cause I I use the Greek, but this is the final form of the eclectic Greek text that we have same thing for the Hebrew.

185
00:21:08.350 --> 00:21:13.080
Rick Boyd: You know this is the Hebrew text. Right? Sorry right here.

186
00:21:13.100 --> 00:21:15.660
Rick Boyd: But this is the new American standard

187
00:21:15.770 --> 00:21:28.589
Rick Boyd: edition, and you can see I've I've go ahead and tape it up because I go through Bibles. Anyway, this is the final form of the text, this, this is where we start.

188
00:21:29.010 --> 00:21:33.760
Rick Boyd: And so you approach the text, not merely for the content.

189
00:21:34.800 --> 00:21:38.910
Rick Boyd: My, I've got a favorite verse, and then another favorite verse, and another favorite verse.

190
00:21:39.130 --> 00:21:43.889
Rick Boyd: But those verses are isolated. Often when we say what my favorite verse is such and such.

191
00:21:43.890 --> 00:21:44.640
Andy Miller III: Right, right.

192
00:21:44.640 --> 00:21:49.119
Rick Boyd: Cause, we take it out of its context and Ibs is all about

193
00:21:49.700 --> 00:22:09.850
Rick Boyd: the version that we have not. Whatever led up to that. If there was an editing process, you know, redaction criticism and and the various other critical methods. We start with the text the way we have it. And we're interested both in the content, but also the way the content is arranged, because the shape of it

194
00:22:09.930 --> 00:22:11.890
Rick Boyd: makes a huge difference.

195
00:22:11.990 --> 00:22:22.900
Rick Boyd: and when it comes to the Book of Hebrews. Everybody has a different opinion. It seems like about the the arrangement of the book of Hebrews. Mine comes from

196
00:22:23.020 --> 00:22:33.930
Rick Boyd: reading through the text, reading through the text, reading through the text, reading through the text, and seeing how I can perceive the text arising and the arrangement of it arising out of the text.

197
00:22:33.950 --> 00:22:36.049
Rick Boyd: And so you start with a text.

198
00:22:36.050 --> 00:22:42.920
Andy Miller III: Yeah. Amen. I want to. I want to ask a few questions on that, too, because I think it'll be helpful for people to understand. And this is this is where

199
00:22:42.980 --> 00:22:58.900
Andy Miller III: denominations, traditions, theologies go awry. This is where problems start to write is that when we don't acknowledge the starting place of the text. But before I ask a question about the starting place, let me just acknowledge the the conversation, or piece.

200
00:22:59.060 --> 00:23:08.969
Andy Miller III: or something I'd like to just discuss in general about the final form. The inductive method, though, doesn't discount or overlook

201
00:23:09.250 --> 00:23:37.559
Andy Miller III: the reality of textual criticism. And what here's what I mean by textual criticism is that we acknowledge. And this is something we work through in our Old Testament and New Testament introduction, so that we don't have like just one text, like as Rick lifted it up, that's instead of original language documents there. There are a variety of documents that are put together, and we have text. So when we do text criticism, it's us looking at those source traditions to figure out what is there. But

202
00:23:37.580 --> 00:23:50.760
Andy Miller III: just because we focus on the final form, Rick. That doesn't mean that we overlook textual criticism. Talk to me about the way that text criticism fits in to the Ibs method.

203
00:23:50.910 --> 00:23:55.649
Rick Boyd: Well, it's not just text criticism, but it's also the the source criticism.

204
00:23:55.650 --> 00:23:56.170
Andy Miller III: Yes, yes.

205
00:23:56.170 --> 00:24:00.780
Rick Boyd: Form criticism. All these critical methodologies which other

206
00:24:01.290 --> 00:24:10.039
Rick Boyd: institutions and a number of scholars start their redaction criticism, and such they start with the assumption that

207
00:24:10.200 --> 00:24:17.140
Rick Boyd: instead, we start with the original with with the final form of the text, and if it is relevant.

208
00:24:17.410 --> 00:24:25.070
Rick Boyd: if it is relevant, we engage the other critical methodologies. Ibs is really a very eclectic

209
00:24:25.390 --> 00:24:31.680
Rick Boyd: approach, but it's very structured as well. There's certain steps you need to take. For instance.

210
00:24:32.150 --> 00:24:34.839
Rick Boyd: when I was in my radio ministry

211
00:24:35.050 --> 00:24:37.880
Rick Boyd: because I was program director. I visited.

212
00:24:38.000 --> 00:24:43.800
Rick Boyd: I visited pastors and churches all over the listening area, and it was pretty good sized listening area.

213
00:24:43.930 --> 00:24:57.410
Rick Boyd: and I visited hundreds of churches and hundreds of pastors from all kinds of denominations, different theological traditions, and very few of them

214
00:24:57.951 --> 00:25:07.450
Rick Boyd: started preparing a sermon in the text. Most of the pastors would go to their shelf, and they'd pull off commentary.

215
00:25:07.680 --> 00:25:08.170
Andy Miller III: Yes.

216
00:25:08.467 --> 00:25:12.630
Rick Boyd: And they would start there. Okay, let's see what the experts have to say.

217
00:25:12.820 --> 00:25:16.450
Rick Boyd: and they don't really engage the text. Well.

218
00:25:16.530 --> 00:25:21.900
Rick Boyd: consulting commentaries is absolutely essential for Bible study.

219
00:25:21.970 --> 00:25:25.279
Rick Boyd: but only after you finished your own study.

220
00:25:25.300 --> 00:25:29.539
Rick Boyd: Yeah. And and Ibs, specifically the way we teach it. At Wesley

221
00:25:29.580 --> 00:25:44.970
Rick Boyd: you learn how to study the Bible based on what the text actually says. You're you're directly studying the Bible, and you're studying both the arrangement of the materials and the materials themselves. So you're trying to understand what the author is doing.

222
00:25:45.020 --> 00:25:47.249
Rick Boyd: If I could give you a quick example.

223
00:25:47.250 --> 00:25:47.980
Andy Miller III: Yeah, yeah.

224
00:25:48.200 --> 00:25:49.759
Rick Boyd: The gospel of Matthew.

225
00:25:49.860 --> 00:25:54.189
Rick Boyd: You know we're most of us are pretty familiar with the gospel of Matthew, so we think.

226
00:25:54.560 --> 00:25:56.319
Rick Boyd: But if you were to read Matthew

227
00:25:56.380 --> 00:25:57.740
Rick Boyd: 28 chapters.

228
00:25:57.810 --> 00:26:00.229
Rick Boyd: and you would read it and then read it again.

229
00:26:00.250 --> 00:26:01.460
Rick Boyd: Read it again.

230
00:26:01.770 --> 00:26:03.940
Rick Boyd: and you really should do this.

231
00:26:04.230 --> 00:26:13.869
Rick Boyd: you would see at least one of the ways to understand the structure of Matthew is that it? It's arranged in 3 different parts, 3 very distinct parts

232
00:26:14.270 --> 00:26:18.730
Rick Boyd: from chapter one verse one, which is the genealogy that's where it begins

233
00:26:18.960 --> 00:26:20.980
Rick Boyd: up through 4 16

234
00:26:21.930 --> 00:26:25.150
Rick Boyd: is really the preparation for Jesus ministry.

235
00:26:25.510 --> 00:26:29.820
Rick Boyd: Oh, there's a lot of information there you got the genealogy you've got

236
00:26:30.030 --> 00:26:45.850
Rick Boyd: the angel appearing to Joseph. You shall call his name Jesus, for he will save his people his people from their sins. They shall call his name Emmanuel, which is God with us. Chapter 2. You've got Herod and the Magi appear. So you've got this battle of kingships.

237
00:26:46.010 --> 00:26:52.829
Rick Boyd: That's easy to overlook. But that's really what chapter 2 is about. It's the the difference between Herod's reign.

238
00:26:53.170 --> 00:27:00.319
Rick Boyd: which is very threatening. Oppressive paranoid over against Jesus, who will shepherd

239
00:27:00.370 --> 00:27:15.379
Rick Boyd: God's people. Israel. Chapter 3. John the baptizer, comes on the scene at the end of chapter 3. He baptizes Jesus. Chapter 4. Begins with Jesus in the wilderness being tempted for 40 days. All of this is preparation.

240
00:27:15.680 --> 00:27:20.719
Rick Boyd: It's giving us background, the information that we need, so that at 4 17

241
00:27:20.960 --> 00:27:22.090
Rick Boyd: in Matthew.

242
00:27:22.190 --> 00:27:23.710
Rick Boyd: From then

243
00:27:23.900 --> 00:27:28.640
Rick Boyd: Jesus began to preach and to say, Repent for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.

244
00:27:29.130 --> 00:27:30.739
Rick Boyd: There's a turning point

245
00:27:31.062 --> 00:27:41.059
Rick Boyd: now. You wouldn't know that just kind of reading through the Gospel. If if you're not made aware of what authors and and how books are arranged, but what authors are doing.

246
00:27:41.470 --> 00:27:47.370
Rick Boyd: and what you end up. What you can see is that it? We get to 1621,

247
00:27:48.390 --> 00:27:53.380
Rick Boyd: which is the second turning point, and this is what divides it into the 3 parts.

248
00:27:53.510 --> 00:28:02.209
Rick Boyd: because at 1621, from then sounds familiar. Jesus began to show his disciples

249
00:28:02.310 --> 00:28:10.240
Rick Boyd: that it's necessary for him to go to Jerusalem, suffer many things from the chief priests and elders be crucified on the third day be raised

250
00:28:10.960 --> 00:28:13.510
Rick Boyd: to actually be killed, and on the third day being raised.

251
00:28:13.640 --> 00:28:15.560
Rick Boyd: And right before that

252
00:28:16.020 --> 00:28:17.749
Rick Boyd: we have Jesus

253
00:28:17.810 --> 00:28:24.430
Rick Boyd: talking to his disciples, saying, Who do people say the Son of man is well, who do you say I am.

254
00:28:24.660 --> 00:28:29.159
Rick Boyd: And the reason for the turning point, which is the major turning point.

255
00:28:29.820 --> 00:28:32.390
Rick Boyd: is the confession of disciples

256
00:28:33.150 --> 00:28:40.460
Rick Boyd: that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the living God, because people in general who have heard the message can't decide who he is.

257
00:28:40.690 --> 00:28:46.180
Rick Boyd: Well, some say you're John the baptizers. Some say you're Eliza Jeremiah, one of the prophets.

258
00:28:46.200 --> 00:28:50.700
Rick Boyd: They can't make up their mind. Disciples say you are the Christ, the Son of the living God.

259
00:28:50.810 --> 00:29:00.220
Rick Boyd: and that changes things. Brothers and sisters when we read the text like that, and we can see very clearly. Matthews arranged this in a particular way.

260
00:29:00.460 --> 00:29:07.670
Rick Boyd: It deepens our understanding of what the text really says, that's Ibs, essentially, it's it's looking at those 2.

261
00:29:08.180 --> 00:29:24.579
Andy Miller III: And you mentioned, too, that we what we do is we start with the text. Well, some people, Rick would suggest, well, we can't just come to text, because, you know, we have our experiences. We learn to read. We were taught. So our experience

262
00:29:24.620 --> 00:29:29.810
Andy Miller III: comes before we ever even get to the text, how do you respond to that.

263
00:29:30.150 --> 00:29:33.629
Rick Boyd: That's a great, great point. Because we do have some students.

264
00:29:33.710 --> 00:30:00.150
Rick Boyd: You know, they're seminary level students, but they they come to the text, and they have been taught. You start with your experience. But the text that we have is objective. It's it's outside of us. And we need to start. If if truly, the Bible is the Word of God, and we hold to that absolutely inherent, it is the Word of God, and I wouldn't be here otherwise. If I hadn't had that encounter with the Lord in the hotel room reading his word.

265
00:30:00.280 --> 00:30:04.120
Rick Boyd: I don't know where I would be. I probably wouldn't be at this point.

266
00:30:04.537 --> 00:30:27.579
Rick Boyd: But the point is, the the Scripture gives us this object reality that needs to be studied objectively. You don't bring your experiences, which is what you're talking about, but any kind of background as well. I mean, if you, if you believe that there is an editing process that gives us, you know Matthew, or one of the other books.

267
00:30:27.720 --> 00:30:31.520
Rick Boyd: You need to leave that off to the side that's called a presupposition.

268
00:30:32.580 --> 00:30:34.339
Rick Boyd: because you assume

269
00:30:34.350 --> 00:30:39.130
Rick Boyd: you're presupposing something that the text may or may not have.

270
00:30:39.380 --> 00:30:52.530
Rick Boyd: I mean some presuppositions. They may be valid, but you don't bring those into the text. You let the text bring out what it wants to to bring out the way it's arranged, as well as with the content.

271
00:30:52.530 --> 00:30:55.784
Andy Miller III: Yeah, I remember I was. I was so committed to that.

272
00:30:56.150 --> 00:31:18.107
Andy Miller III: this perspective, or or or trying to to use this method. Man. I you'll you'll know that the exact reference? But there's a a couple of places in the New Testament. I oh, man, I wanna say it's Galatians, where it identifies Peter as cfus right? And so they describe like

273
00:31:18.840 --> 00:31:29.249
Andy Miller III: and I. And I went ahead just because in in this, if this focuses not Ibs focuses not just on the final form, but also helping people understand in

274
00:31:29.390 --> 00:31:55.709
Andy Miller III: in the English language, right? And starting there, because that's where most people start, but then it still incorporates original languages, as is the case with you. But I remember in my inductive Bible study lesson, just writing well, who is cfus anyways like I didn't. I didn't even want to make the assumption that I knew that that was Peter, even though, being around Sunday school enough, and you'll know we've already talked about David Bauer. I was taking a class with David Bauer doing this assignment for him.

275
00:31:55.910 --> 00:32:21.049
Andy Miller III: and the greater said, no need to do this right. He he's like no need. We know this. But then, in a different color pen on top of that David Bauer scratched out and said, No, he's got the method right. They're like, because I was trying to say, like, I don't know like the the quite. I'm bringing my outside understanding that Cfus is Peter. So that was that was a win. Sorry to glorify myself here, but that was that was a win for me in looking at the original text.

276
00:32:21.660 --> 00:32:28.570
Rick Boyd: That's what we need to learn to do. Because we can't bring our assumptions into the text. Well, I know what this means.

277
00:32:28.590 --> 00:32:36.269
Rick Boyd: But does the text really say that you may be bringing it in from another source? And the author of the book you're studying? It's a very book centric

278
00:32:36.510 --> 00:32:47.800
Rick Boyd: study method. But it's not limited to individual books. Eventually it comes into conversation with the rest of Scripture. So really inductive Bible study is holistic

279
00:32:48.450 --> 00:32:50.849
Rick Boyd: in the sense that

280
00:32:51.750 --> 00:32:55.300
Rick Boyd: it incorporates everything that is relevant.

281
00:32:55.650 --> 00:33:00.710
Rick Boyd: and it does it according to the book that you're studying the particular book.

282
00:33:00.850 --> 00:33:04.300
Rick Boyd: Most people don't read 4 books at the same time.

283
00:33:04.520 --> 00:33:07.809
Rick Boyd: You know you're not reading Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. Altogether.

284
00:33:08.200 --> 00:33:21.960
Rick Boyd: You're reading one at a time, that's that's all we can do. And so Matthew tells the story of Jesus with a particular emphasis, in a particular way, arranged a particular way.

285
00:33:22.290 --> 00:33:23.300
Rick Boyd: Mark

286
00:33:23.610 --> 00:33:25.850
Rick Boyd: presents the story of Jesus.

287
00:33:26.130 --> 00:33:29.809
Rick Boyd: A lot of similarities between Matthew and Mark and Luke.

288
00:33:30.100 --> 00:33:39.149
Rick Boyd: but they're told with different emphases for a different purpose to a different audience. These are very specific. They didn't just drop out of the sky.

289
00:33:39.280 --> 00:33:43.619
Rick Boyd: They were written by people inspired by the Holy Spirit

290
00:33:44.300 --> 00:33:47.520
Rick Boyd: to reach a particular audience.

291
00:33:47.880 --> 00:33:57.039
Rick Boyd: and when these were collected we have these 4 gospels. We need all 4 perspectives because they get they have the same subject matter, Jesus.

292
00:33:57.600 --> 00:34:00.489
Rick Boyd: but they're they give us different insights.

293
00:34:00.610 --> 00:34:03.369
Rick Boyd: different understandings, gospel of Matthew.

294
00:34:03.810 --> 00:34:09.269
Rick Boyd: And this is this is an IBS. Thing, the Gospel of Matthew. In chapter one, verse 23,

295
00:34:09.710 --> 00:34:14.840
Rick Boyd: they will call his name in Manu. Well, this is a quote from Isaiah 7.

296
00:34:14.980 --> 00:34:19.590
Rick Boyd: They will call his name Emmanuel, which is translated God with us.

297
00:34:20.040 --> 00:34:23.189
Rick Boyd: The very last verse in the gospel of Matthew.

298
00:34:23.270 --> 00:34:28.399
Rick Boyd: And surely I am with you always to the very end of the age.

299
00:34:29.260 --> 00:34:34.489
Rick Boyd: and that is an that is a structural relationship. One of the things you learn in Ivs

300
00:34:34.670 --> 00:34:39.109
Rick Boyd: structural relationship called inclusio. It acts like bookends.

301
00:34:39.150 --> 00:34:41.229
Rick Boyd: and it informs

302
00:34:41.270 --> 00:34:42.850
Rick Boyd: what's in between the 2 bookends.

303
00:34:42.850 --> 00:34:43.880
Andy Miller III: Yes, Amen.

304
00:34:43.880 --> 00:34:48.650
Rick Boyd: And so the Book of Matthew can really be understood through one lens

305
00:34:48.880 --> 00:34:51.830
Rick Boyd: as Jesus being God with us.

306
00:34:52.120 --> 00:34:54.849
Rick Boyd: Now there are references to the Holy Spirit.

307
00:34:55.000 --> 00:35:03.759
Rick Boyd: and certainly Matthew does not deny the Holy Spirit at all. In fact, it includes the Holy Spirit as the one who would be speaking through you. In Matthew 10.

308
00:35:04.160 --> 00:35:05.409
Rick Boyd: The thing is.

309
00:35:05.560 --> 00:35:07.579
Rick Boyd: Jesus is presented

310
00:35:07.740 --> 00:35:11.580
Rick Boyd: as God with us, and that's absolutely true.

311
00:35:11.830 --> 00:35:14.449
Rick Boyd: You get to Luke, and Luke

312
00:35:14.540 --> 00:35:22.190
Rick Boyd: presents Jesus slightly differently. There's a different emphasis that Jesus becomes one of us

313
00:35:22.230 --> 00:35:24.759
Rick Boyd: and blazes the trail for us.

314
00:35:24.830 --> 00:35:27.630
Rick Boyd: And what's interesting about Luke is

315
00:35:27.860 --> 00:35:32.329
Rick Boyd: the dependence that Jesus has on the Holy Spirit.

316
00:35:32.330 --> 00:35:32.990
Andy Miller III: Yes.

317
00:35:33.340 --> 00:35:34.030
Rick Boyd: Now

318
00:35:34.210 --> 00:35:48.950
Rick Boyd: the the 2 2 different versions you got Matthew, or the 2 different books you got, Matthew and you got Luke. They don't deny one another, but they're presenting it with different emphases. And so we get a fuller picture with all 4 gospels

319
00:35:49.150 --> 00:35:50.119
Rick Boyd: is what we do.

320
00:35:50.120 --> 00:35:53.239
Andy Miller III: Well. And then, speaking of different emphases.

321
00:35:53.310 --> 00:36:04.870
Andy Miller III: that's one of the challenges of why the Book of Hebrews, or the sermon of Hebrew, called Hebrews, or the sermon to the Hebrews, or however we want to describe it. That's in part

322
00:36:04.990 --> 00:36:22.119
Andy Miller III: why, it's been hard. Why, people have. Scholars have struggled with it. The Greek in it is, some would say, harder, harder to read, harder to understand, different from what's happening in other passages. Other other portions of the New Testament, and

323
00:36:22.120 --> 00:36:39.310
Andy Miller III: a different emphasis, and you maintain that one of the things about Hebrews is the filial, that family, the word filial kind of connected word family presentation of Jesus as a son. So I just want to Jesus as a son. Hence not just Jesus as the Son, but also

324
00:36:39.460 --> 00:36:41.709
Andy Miller III: Jesus, then as the brother.

325
00:36:42.814 --> 00:36:45.419
Andy Miller III: So, and I'm not talking about

326
00:36:45.600 --> 00:36:54.740
Andy Miller III: to James, but to us as well. So I just want to read this. The the Intro. The very first verse is honestly, every time the time comes up for me

327
00:36:54.990 --> 00:37:15.770
Andy Miller III: and my yearly Bible reading I'm a read the Bible every year. Sort of guy some people will call me a legalist because of that. It's just. It works for me. It works for me to get. And I I love working through Scripture, hearing the story over and over again. But whatever day lands for me with getting Hebrews, one generally is 1, one through 3. I get.

328
00:37:15.770 --> 00:37:32.809
Andy Miller III: boy. That's a great day just hearing these words. And so I'm gonna read this, Rick. And I want us to think about what what is trying, what what the author of Hebrews is trying to do, and how that presentation at Jesus' Son is different. So verse one. Chapter one, in Hebrews

329
00:37:32.860 --> 00:37:45.270
Andy Miller III: and in the past God spoke to our ancestors through the prophets at many times and in various ways, but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son.

330
00:37:45.380 --> 00:38:00.140
Andy Miller III: whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom also He made the universe. Now I could keep going on. It keeps on. The sun is the exact is a radiance, a God's glory. I'm I'm going to read another verse. Sorry I can't help myself.

331
00:38:00.597 --> 00:38:16.460
Andy Miller III: The exact, the radiance of God's glory, the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purifications for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven. So he became

332
00:38:16.530 --> 00:38:23.449
Andy Miller III: as much superior to the angels as the name he has inherited is superior to theirs.

333
00:38:23.470 --> 00:38:28.269
Andy Miller III: So your interpretation, your inductive work through Hebrews.

334
00:38:28.310 --> 00:38:35.119
Andy Miller III: emphasizes this role as Jesus's and Son. Help us know why that's important. Why, that's a distinct contribution.

335
00:38:35.730 --> 00:38:36.970
Rick Boyd: By the way.

336
00:38:37.300 --> 00:38:39.970
Rick Boyd: this is one of the things I love about you, brother.

337
00:38:40.090 --> 00:38:41.719
Rick Boyd: is the fact that

338
00:38:41.730 --> 00:38:59.190
Rick Boyd: you and I are so expressive. We we get carried away, and I can tell you if there's a chapel service here on campus, or even a meeting and some, and somebody says something out of Scripture that we can't help but affirm, what are the 2 that people here?

339
00:38:59.960 --> 00:39:05.640
Rick Boyd: And so this is kind of a dangerous mix here, but it's great, and I love that about you.

340
00:39:06.150 --> 00:39:07.290
Andy Miller III: And I love it about you.

341
00:39:07.290 --> 00:39:08.797
Rick Boyd: What? What

342
00:39:09.410 --> 00:39:15.269
Rick Boyd: What I see at the beginning of the Book of Hebrews really does prepare us for the whole book, the whole book.

343
00:39:15.510 --> 00:39:21.899
Rick Boyd: and that's unusual. I don't know that that I come across anybody else really identifying that.

344
00:39:22.130 --> 00:39:25.209
Rick Boyd: And that's part of a book that I'm writing

345
00:39:25.260 --> 00:39:31.900
Rick Boyd: is based on my thesis. It's kind of a revision of my thesis, and so that's at the heart of it.

346
00:39:31.940 --> 00:39:34.289
Rick Boyd: Are this the first verse and a half.

347
00:39:34.790 --> 00:39:37.870
Rick Boyd: and I'll I'll translate it. I'll give you my translation.

348
00:39:37.870 --> 00:39:38.540
Andy Miller III: Okay. Gotcha.

349
00:39:38.540 --> 00:39:47.039
Rick Boyd: On the fly, because I want to point a couple of things out here which are unusual. In fact, they're unique. I don't know of somebody else doing this

350
00:39:47.200 --> 00:39:48.010
Rick Boyd: about.

351
00:39:48.010 --> 00:39:52.279
Andy Miller III: Second, Rick. Sure, something. I think your microphone just changed.

352
00:39:53.310 --> 00:39:58.219
Andy Miller III: I don't know if it got unplugged or something happened. But you're you. It's that it won't be bad.

353
00:39:58.260 --> 00:39:59.505
Andy Miller III: but it is

354
00:40:00.549 --> 00:40:01.509
Rick Boyd: You able to hear it now.

355
00:40:01.510 --> 00:40:10.360
Andy Miller III: Yeah, I hear you, but it's just a little different, so it'll be fine. But I'm not. I'm not again. I'm not like going for a radio, perfect.

356
00:40:10.930 --> 00:40:13.120
Andy Miller III: the podcast but

357
00:40:14.638 --> 00:40:19.989
Andy Miller III: but I just in just in case there was like there was a cord that was unplugged. I thought I'd give you a chance to get that.

358
00:40:21.082 --> 00:40:24.409
Rick Boyd: Everything is still connected. That's right. In front of me.

359
00:40:24.640 --> 00:40:31.070
Andy Miller III: I'll I'll say 3, 2, one, and that will give Jeff. He'll may be able. Make the edit. Alright. 3, 2, one.

360
00:40:31.450 --> 00:40:34.310
Rick Boyd: Alright. So I wanna kind of share

361
00:40:34.710 --> 00:40:39.350
Rick Boyd: the beginning of the Book of Hebrews, you know the first verse and a half which I think, prepares.

362
00:40:39.360 --> 00:40:40.629
Rick Boyd: you know, for the whole book.

363
00:40:40.720 --> 00:40:43.550
Rick Boyd: and giving you my translation from the Greek

364
00:40:44.316 --> 00:40:47.690
Rick Boyd: and and I don't know of anybody else who does this

365
00:40:47.980 --> 00:40:49.759
Rick Boyd: that sees it this particular way.

366
00:40:50.090 --> 00:40:52.309
Rick Boyd: but I don't know that anybody can deny it.

367
00:40:52.990 --> 00:41:01.890
Rick Boyd: I don't I don't. I don't think so. So in the Greek. The first words are Paul Lumarrows, kai polytropos, many parts

368
00:41:02.200 --> 00:41:03.872
Rick Boyd: and many ways.

369
00:41:04.450 --> 00:41:07.190
Rick Boyd: So that's the opening words of

370
00:41:07.280 --> 00:41:09.430
Rick Boyd: the the serving. I think it is a survey.

371
00:41:09.430 --> 00:41:09.750
Andy Miller III: Okay.

372
00:41:09.750 --> 00:41:12.950
Rick Boyd: So many parts in many ways. Long ago.

373
00:41:13.060 --> 00:41:17.280
Rick Boyd: God having spoken to the fathers in the prophets

374
00:41:17.660 --> 00:41:19.760
Rick Boyd: in these last days.

375
00:41:19.810 --> 00:41:22.440
Rick Boyd: he has spoken to us in a son.

376
00:41:22.890 --> 00:41:29.479
Rick Boyd: Now I think that is preparing us for the entire book that is giving us a lens through which

377
00:41:29.680 --> 00:41:32.730
Rick Boyd: we can see what's going on when

378
00:41:32.780 --> 00:41:37.150
Rick Boyd: the writer gets into some difficult stuff for us in the 20 first century.

379
00:41:37.430 --> 00:41:42.320
Rick Boyd: Who's Melchizedek? And we don't deal with high priests, and all of that.

380
00:41:42.630 --> 00:41:46.359
Rick Boyd: because in this first verse and a half

381
00:41:46.580 --> 00:41:49.120
Rick Boyd: we have a contrast that is set up

382
00:41:49.580 --> 00:41:57.190
Rick Boyd: from the very outset. And that's what we see repeatedly throughout the book is the contrast between essentially the Old Testament

383
00:41:57.370 --> 00:41:59.260
Rick Boyd: and the coming of Christ.

384
00:41:59.490 --> 00:42:00.670
Rick Boyd: So you've got the

385
00:42:00.700 --> 00:42:03.679
Rick Boyd: Old Testament sacrificial system. You got the

386
00:42:03.750 --> 00:42:06.979
Rick Boyd: Old Testament, priesthood

387
00:42:07.130 --> 00:42:09.010
Rick Boyd: and the sacrificial system.

388
00:42:09.100 --> 00:42:19.260
Rick Boyd: We've got Moses over against Jesus, we repeated over and over and over again. That takes us through most of the book, if not all of them. Even in chapter 12

389
00:42:19.410 --> 00:42:22.740
Rick Boyd: we have Mount Sinai over against Mount Sinai.

390
00:42:23.220 --> 00:42:25.019
Rick Boyd: starting in verse 18.

391
00:42:25.700 --> 00:42:27.200
Rick Boyd: So here

392
00:42:27.330 --> 00:42:30.370
Rick Boyd: we have this contrast that's set up at the very beginning.

393
00:42:30.930 --> 00:42:34.479
Rick Boyd: many parts in many ways, long ago.

394
00:42:35.120 --> 00:42:38.190
Rick Boyd: Well, in verse 2, it's in these last days.

395
00:42:39.590 --> 00:42:40.270
Rick Boyd: Okay, yeah.

396
00:42:40.270 --> 00:42:41.590
Andy Miller III: Yeah, I see that contrast.

397
00:42:41.780 --> 00:42:45.500
Rick Boyd: Then we have. God spoke to the fathers.

398
00:42:45.670 --> 00:42:47.929
Rick Boyd: now he has spoken to us.

399
00:42:49.480 --> 00:42:52.330
Rick Boyd: and then we have in the profits

400
00:42:53.150 --> 00:42:54.450
Rick Boyd: in a sun.

401
00:42:54.450 --> 00:43:00.938
Andy Miller III: So even in like I mean so the fathers would be a more accurate translation. There's not

402
00:43:01.320 --> 00:43:02.789
Rick Boyd: In in verse one.

403
00:43:02.790 --> 00:43:04.080
Andy Miller III: Okay, interesting.

404
00:43:04.080 --> 00:43:06.329
Rick Boyd: In the fathers over against

405
00:43:06.380 --> 00:43:07.460
Rick Boyd: in a sun.

406
00:43:07.720 --> 00:43:09.410
Rick Boyd: So you've got this confusing answer.

407
00:43:09.410 --> 00:43:14.649
Andy Miller III: Doesn't really work like as it's often translated, because it doesn't catch the contrast.

408
00:43:14.650 --> 00:43:19.879
Rick Boyd: Exactly. I I don't think it catches it quite as clearly. And the fathers over against

409
00:43:20.020 --> 00:43:23.920
Rick Boyd: or in the father. No, it's not in the fathers it's in the profits

410
00:43:24.050 --> 00:43:41.860
Rick Boyd: over against in a son. That's the one contrast a prophets a son. And then you've got spoken to the fathers over against spoken to us. It's not to the fathers. And so what this is doing is, it's looking back at the Old Testament in its entirety.

411
00:43:42.740 --> 00:43:49.970
Rick Boyd: So what the author is doing from the very outset is he's contrasting the way God spoke in the Old Testament.

412
00:43:50.660 --> 00:43:56.560
Rick Boyd: It was long ago. It was to the fathers. It was in the prophets, and what God has now spoken

413
00:43:57.663 --> 00:44:01.909
Rick Boyd: in these last days, not long ago, but in these last days

414
00:44:02.430 --> 00:44:05.190
Rick Boyd: to us, not to the fathers

415
00:44:05.440 --> 00:44:07.059
Rick Boyd: and in a sun.

416
00:44:07.970 --> 00:44:14.830
Rick Boyd: But you may notice, and I hope you do. The opening words in the Greek are many parts in many ways

417
00:44:14.940 --> 00:44:16.670
Rick Boyd: that doesn't have a compliment

418
00:44:16.940 --> 00:44:18.189
Rick Boyd: for the contrast.

419
00:44:18.680 --> 00:44:21.409
Rick Boyd: What do you contrast that against? Hmm.

420
00:44:21.990 --> 00:44:23.790
Rick Boyd: And I can tell you.

421
00:44:23.960 --> 00:44:26.839
Rick Boyd: and this is becoming more and more apparent to me all the time.

422
00:44:27.630 --> 00:44:29.809
Rick Boyd: The missing compliment

423
00:44:30.720 --> 00:44:32.850
Rick Boyd: may be the point of emphasis.

424
00:44:33.120 --> 00:44:34.150
Andy Miller III: Okay.

425
00:44:34.150 --> 00:44:35.010
Rick Boyd: Because

426
00:44:35.180 --> 00:44:40.870
Rick Boyd: the compliment for which is not not mentioned here. But it's implicit.

427
00:44:40.980 --> 00:44:44.640
Rick Boyd: The complement to many parts and many ways

428
00:44:45.570 --> 00:44:47.720
Rick Boyd: is completely it's perfect.

429
00:44:49.180 --> 00:44:51.970
Rick Boyd: and what God has spoken in

430
00:44:52.060 --> 00:44:53.070
Rick Boyd: the sun

431
00:44:53.800 --> 00:44:55.029
Rick Boyd: in a sun

432
00:44:55.710 --> 00:44:57.450
Rick Boyd: is perfection.

433
00:44:57.730 --> 00:44:59.260
Rick Boyd: It's completion.

434
00:44:59.820 --> 00:45:03.000
Rick Boyd: and this is the point of Christ coming.

435
00:45:03.960 --> 00:45:06.540
Rick Boyd: So He has come to make us complete.

436
00:45:07.230 --> 00:45:11.970
Rick Boyd: He has come to be. And here this gets to your point of brothers.

437
00:45:11.970 --> 00:45:12.800
Andy Miller III: Yes, yes.

438
00:45:12.800 --> 00:45:15.979
Rick Boyd: He has come to complete the human.

439
00:45:16.540 --> 00:45:19.189
Rick Boyd: to make the human perfect, to make it complete

440
00:45:19.490 --> 00:45:23.990
Rick Boyd: with the obedience. I mean, we have that very clearly as well.

441
00:45:24.627 --> 00:45:28.830
Rick Boyd: This concept of obedience, but he has perfected us

442
00:45:29.750 --> 00:45:34.219
Rick Boyd: who are his brothers. He calls us his brothers. In chapter 2,

443
00:45:34.840 --> 00:45:36.059
Rick Boyd: chapter 2,

444
00:45:36.770 --> 00:45:37.810
Rick Boyd: some.

445
00:45:38.310 --> 00:45:41.759
Rick Boyd: let me go back to verse 11. So, chapter 2, verse 11,

446
00:45:42.570 --> 00:45:47.589
Rick Boyd: for the one sanctifying, and the ones being sanctified.

447
00:45:48.050 --> 00:45:51.319
Rick Boyd: are all from one, on account of which reason

448
00:45:51.440 --> 00:45:58.460
Rick Boyd: he, Jesus, is not ashamed to call them brothers, saying.

449
00:45:58.620 --> 00:46:01.319
Rick Boyd: I will declare your name God

450
00:46:01.650 --> 00:46:10.799
Rick Boyd: to my brothers. In the midst of the ecclesia, which is the church? Yeah, in the midst of the congregation I will him view

451
00:46:11.050 --> 00:46:13.320
Rick Boyd: literally him. I will

452
00:46:13.360 --> 00:46:15.100
Rick Boyd: sing songs I will hymn to.

453
00:46:15.150 --> 00:46:18.710
Rick Boyd: And again, verse 13 again, I myself

454
00:46:18.950 --> 00:46:25.070
Rick Boyd: will be having trusted upon him. So, in other words, Jesus did exactly what we're called to do.

455
00:46:25.680 --> 00:46:27.739
Rick Boyd: trusting in God.

456
00:46:28.180 --> 00:46:28.999
Rick Boyd: and they do, and.

457
00:46:29.000 --> 00:46:42.589
Andy Miller III: Interesting. Oh, let me jump in because there's like the interesting idea all throughout Hebrews. This idea, and I remember from my own study the importance of the word rk, gost or Rk. Goy

458
00:46:42.590 --> 00:46:59.210
Andy Miller III: sometimes translated Pioneer, the pioneer and perfector. But what is what is Jesus doing as the one who's going ahead paving the way. But but that doesn't. But that even pioneer doesn't fully get to the idea like he's like this champion. This one who

459
00:46:59.660 --> 00:47:07.580
Andy Miller III: goes first, you know, goes, goes ahead of. And and how is it, then, like when we think of God as triune.

460
00:47:07.630 --> 00:47:09.150
Andy Miller III: that it is that

461
00:47:09.230 --> 00:47:31.689
Andy Miller III: that Jesus is the son in this sense, and is like us, is going going ahead of us. I don't mean to get us too far off track, but this this is trying to describe, like what is, what is the works, the happenings that come as a result of what Jesus did, so help us understand that concept of of pioneer, and how that's connected to Jesus being our brother.

462
00:47:32.140 --> 00:47:40.330
Rick Boyd: That that word archaic, I mean, I'm glad you pointed that out because it only occurs 4 times in the New Testament, and 2 of them in the Book of Heat, so.

463
00:47:40.550 --> 00:47:41.140
Andy Miller III: Okay.

464
00:47:41.140 --> 00:47:54.210
Rick Boyd: And they're both pointing directly to. But all kinds of stuff fills my head, as you can imagine. Because Moses is called an ark. Goss in numbers 14.

465
00:47:55.320 --> 00:47:56.170
Rick Boyd: It's it's.

466
00:47:56.170 --> 00:47:57.229
Andy Miller III: The Septuagint.

467
00:47:57.500 --> 00:48:07.559
Rick Boyd: In the Septuagint. It's archaic in the Hebrew. Obviously be different. Be a different word. But in the Septuagint it's archaic. Let us find for ourselves another archaic.

468
00:48:07.560 --> 00:48:08.210
Andy Miller III: Okay. Got.

469
00:48:08.210 --> 00:48:15.100
Rick Boyd: This is after is the Israelites refused to cross the Jordan and conquer Cainan because the people are so big.

470
00:48:15.458 --> 00:48:20.369
Rick Boyd: If you remember that story, and that is used heavily in chapters 3 and 4 of Hebrews.

471
00:48:20.370 --> 00:48:20.930
Andy Miller III: Okay.

472
00:48:20.930 --> 00:48:28.719
Rick Boyd: Well, Moses is an archaic, and in chapter 3, Jesus is superior to Moses, and it's because he is a son.

473
00:48:29.180 --> 00:48:33.649
Rick Boyd: But this this concept of our chaos, which is translated Pioneer.

474
00:48:35.120 --> 00:48:40.020
Rick Boyd: Very early on, in my my doctoral studies I came to understand, I dug into this word

475
00:48:40.490 --> 00:48:41.639
Rick Boyd: RK.

476
00:48:42.410 --> 00:48:45.190
Rick Boyd: Which is beginning or leader.

477
00:48:45.620 --> 00:48:50.669
Rick Boyd: You know we have an archbishop is the lead bishop, that's our team. And

478
00:48:50.880 --> 00:48:53.700
Rick Boyd: so so it it has to do with lead

479
00:48:54.370 --> 00:48:56.180
Rick Boyd: or preeminent first.

480
00:48:56.520 --> 00:48:59.759
Rick Boyd: and the other word arcade dos

481
00:48:59.780 --> 00:49:01.100
Rick Boyd: from ago.

482
00:49:01.640 --> 00:49:03.250
Rick Boyd: which means to lead.

483
00:49:04.385 --> 00:49:09.120
Rick Boyd: It's a verb that means delete so literally in rk. Goss is a lead leader.

484
00:49:09.120 --> 00:49:10.080
Andy Miller III: Okay.

485
00:49:10.340 --> 00:49:15.300
Rick Boyd: And so pioneer makes perfect sense. Some translations say, Captain.

486
00:49:15.794 --> 00:49:23.289
Rick Boyd: author and perfector of the faith that that that concept is there. I like of those 3 options pioneer.

487
00:49:23.670 --> 00:49:30.190
Rick Boyd: But what I came to understand very early on is that it's like, if I don't. Were you homeschooled? I don't know.

488
00:49:30.190 --> 00:49:34.759
Andy Miller III: I was indeed. Yeah, I was sixth grade on, and and my wife home schools, our kids.

489
00:49:34.760 --> 00:49:41.960
Rick Boyd: Okay. Well, I remember being in first grade, second grade, third grade. I was stick to elementary school. That school doesn't exist anymore.

490
00:49:42.150 --> 00:49:51.050
Rick Boyd: And I remember the teacher taking us on a field trip to the high School, some somewhere close by, where she could walk with us.

491
00:49:51.120 --> 00:49:54.450
Rick Boyd: and she would take the first student by the hand.

492
00:49:55.300 --> 00:49:58.239
Rick Boyd: and that first student took the second student by the hand.

493
00:49:58.250 --> 00:50:01.330
Rick Boyd: So we form this chain of students.

494
00:50:01.820 --> 00:50:12.799
Rick Boyd: and it's really cute to to look at. You see the teacher. And there were chaperones, too. But you, you see, the teacher and all the kids are holding their hands as they're following this lead leader.

495
00:50:13.520 --> 00:50:16.010
Rick Boyd: So the teacher was leading the way.

496
00:50:16.010 --> 00:50:16.660
Andy Miller III: Yeah, yeah.

497
00:50:16.660 --> 00:50:19.299
Rick Boyd: That that's the sense of this word archaic.

498
00:50:19.630 --> 00:50:20.520
Andy Miller III: Interesting.

499
00:50:20.520 --> 00:50:24.210
Rick Boyd: It's not just someone who cuts through the underbrush for the first time.

500
00:50:24.280 --> 00:50:29.070
Rick Boyd: and pioneers the way for everybody else to follow. That's a good sense to understand.

501
00:50:29.120 --> 00:50:32.059
Rick Boyd: But this is even more intimate, more personal.

502
00:50:32.420 --> 00:50:34.490
Rick Boyd: because he's got us by the hand

503
00:50:34.848 --> 00:50:38.460
Rick Boyd: as he's leading us. And in verse 10 of chapter 2.

504
00:50:38.880 --> 00:50:43.989
Rick Boyd: It was fitting for him, on account of whom are all things, and through whom are all things?

505
00:50:45.710 --> 00:50:46.700
Rick Boyd: to

506
00:50:46.920 --> 00:50:49.529
Rick Boyd: for the the Arcade Goths

507
00:50:49.940 --> 00:50:53.560
Rick Boyd: to lead many sons and daughters

508
00:50:53.740 --> 00:50:58.740
Rick Boyd: into glory, the pioneer or the lead leader of their salvation.

509
00:51:00.340 --> 00:51:02.679
Rick Boyd: So this is what he's pioneering.

510
00:51:03.120 --> 00:51:05.590
Rick Boyd: and we are to follow in behind him.

511
00:51:05.920 --> 00:51:12.220
Rick Boyd: He is the one who, it says, leads many sons. That is this filial relationship

512
00:51:12.370 --> 00:51:27.669
Rick Boyd: which Jesus pioneered for us. He is the Son who did that, and then at in chapter 12, we are to run race with perseverance, fixing our eyes on Jesus, the pioneer and perfecter of.

513
00:51:27.900 --> 00:51:29.949
Rick Boyd: and there is no pronoun.

514
00:51:30.420 --> 00:51:34.029
Rick Boyd: Faith! So it's it's not our faith. But there is an article.

515
00:51:34.520 --> 00:51:36.340
Rick Boyd: So it is the faith.

516
00:51:37.430 --> 00:51:42.420
Rick Boyd: And if you think about it, chapter 12 comes immediately after Chapter 11,

517
00:51:43.000 --> 00:51:48.780
Rick Boyd: where the whole chapter by faith, by faith, by faith, by faith, by faith.

518
00:51:48.810 --> 00:51:51.699
Rick Boyd: And it's it covers the Old Testament, basically.

519
00:51:52.510 --> 00:51:53.270
Andy Miller III: Yes, yes.

520
00:51:53.270 --> 00:51:56.609
Rick Boyd: So this couples with that first verse and a half.

521
00:51:57.570 --> 00:52:00.590
Rick Boyd: because God spoke in bits and pieces

522
00:52:00.930 --> 00:52:02.220
Rick Boyd: in the Old Testament

523
00:52:02.320 --> 00:52:03.730
Rick Boyd: many parts

524
00:52:04.050 --> 00:52:05.590
Rick Boyd: in many ways.

525
00:52:05.920 --> 00:52:10.569
Rick Boyd: but in these last days he's spoken to us completely and perfectly.

526
00:52:10.660 --> 00:52:13.140
Rick Boyd: not just in his son

527
00:52:13.760 --> 00:52:15.379
Rick Boyd: or in the sum.

528
00:52:15.630 --> 00:52:17.840
Rick Boyd: But I maintain in sunshine

529
00:52:18.660 --> 00:52:24.609
Rick Boyd: that the way he spoke to us this is what a Son of God, daughter of God, looks like.

530
00:52:24.830 --> 00:52:30.510
Rick Boyd: This is what a son or daughter of God does. And this son or daughter of God referring to us.

531
00:52:30.900 --> 00:52:33.220
Rick Boyd: we follow the stuff.

532
00:52:34.020 --> 00:52:37.049
Rick Boyd: the one who is the pioneer who is the lead leader.

533
00:52:37.260 --> 00:52:38.870
Rick Boyd: That's who we follow

534
00:52:39.450 --> 00:52:45.170
Rick Boyd: because he has blazed the trail. He is in Chapter 6. He's referred to as our forerunner

535
00:52:46.640 --> 00:52:49.760
Rick Boyd: because he is gone behind the veil, and he is actually

536
00:52:49.880 --> 00:52:53.039
Rick Boyd: made a way for us to be in the very presence of God.

537
00:52:54.350 --> 00:52:56.740
Rick Boyd: And so it's a very important

538
00:52:56.800 --> 00:52:59.320
Rick Boyd: aspect. This archaic concept

539
00:52:59.340 --> 00:53:04.190
Rick Boyd: is very important, because Jesus didn't just make away for us by dying.

540
00:53:04.620 --> 00:53:05.320
Andy Miller III: Height.

541
00:53:05.320 --> 00:53:08.730
Rick Boyd: But he blazed the trail for us by living the life we are called to live.

542
00:53:08.960 --> 00:53:10.610
Rick Boyd: and we follow in behind him.

543
00:53:11.640 --> 00:53:18.340
Andy Miller III: One of the things that I think about with the fact we're called to follow in this path. We think of Christ's brother.

544
00:53:18.410 --> 00:53:24.280
Andy Miller III: some might say, well, and I've seen some. I've seen some hymns that do this.

545
00:53:24.590 --> 00:53:27.659
Andy Miller III: I can't think of off top my head. But even even people

546
00:53:27.750 --> 00:53:30.910
Andy Miller III: might even call Jesus our Father, to sort.

547
00:53:30.910 --> 00:53:31.660
Rick Boyd: And agree.

548
00:53:32.008 --> 00:53:51.890
Andy Miller III: And if that happens they, it might be cause. There's a sense of reverence that thinking of Jesus as brother might diminish his divinity to some people is I? I'm trying to set this up for you, but it's not something that I believe myself, but but it might seem like, oh, well, we're making him

549
00:53:51.940 --> 00:53:55.411
Andy Miller III: too common, too much like us.

550
00:53:56.110 --> 00:53:59.159
Andy Miller III: that's not what's happening in Hebrews, obviously. But

551
00:53:59.270 --> 00:54:04.910
Andy Miller III: to help us with that idea, maybe some people are uncomfortable with the idea of Christ being our brother.

552
00:54:05.320 --> 00:54:09.660
Rick Boyd: I understand that all too well. Because

553
00:54:10.270 --> 00:54:16.120
Rick Boyd: I am a perfectionist, and I was. I was warned about that.

554
00:54:16.240 --> 00:54:24.830
Rick Boyd: I need to be careful about that, and we're touching on that very thing here. I want every verse in Scripture to come with the full package

555
00:54:25.671 --> 00:54:31.139
Rick Boyd: to answer every question and every issue. And that's not. It's simply not what we have.

556
00:54:31.360 --> 00:54:36.519
Rick Boyd: So he is presented primarily as son in the book of Hebrews

557
00:54:37.240 --> 00:54:42.239
Rick Boyd: from the very beginning, and he's not just, son. He's the archetypal.

558
00:54:42.610 --> 00:54:45.279
Rick Boyd: I guess, son. More than that, though.

559
00:54:45.370 --> 00:54:47.150
Rick Boyd: Yeah, because he is God.

560
00:54:47.410 --> 00:54:49.410
Rick Boyd: and there's no question in Chapter one. He's.

561
00:54:49.410 --> 00:54:50.830
Andy Miller III: Through whom all things are made. Yeah.

562
00:54:50.830 --> 00:54:52.910
Rick Boyd: Exactly. That's exactly right.

563
00:54:52.950 --> 00:54:57.849
Rick Boyd: And so, and plus the fact that that I believe, chapter 5, verse 8,

564
00:55:00.010 --> 00:55:02.530
Rick Boyd: reinforces the eternity

565
00:55:02.560 --> 00:55:03.740
Rick Boyd: of the sun.

566
00:55:04.660 --> 00:55:12.349
Rick Boyd: Because Hebrews 5, 8, reads, although, being a son, he learned the obedience from the things he suffered.

567
00:55:12.640 --> 00:55:13.230
Andy Miller III: Right.

568
00:55:13.430 --> 00:55:15.920
Rick Boyd: But the way, although being

569
00:55:16.120 --> 00:55:18.040
Rick Boyd: a son, is written.

570
00:55:18.110 --> 00:55:19.619
Rick Boyd: it's a present part is simple.

571
00:55:19.850 --> 00:55:23.009
Rick Boyd: It indicates existence, ontology.

572
00:55:23.850 --> 00:55:24.650
Andy Miller III: Yeah, so.

573
00:55:24.650 --> 00:55:26.880
Rick Boyd: Though he's forever been a son.

574
00:55:27.110 --> 00:55:28.820
Rick Boyd: and he always will be.

575
00:55:29.110 --> 00:55:30.940
Rick Boyd: He is simply being

576
00:55:31.010 --> 00:55:32.080
Rick Boyd: a son.

577
00:55:32.640 --> 00:55:35.660
Rick Boyd: He took on flesh and learned just like we do

578
00:55:35.930 --> 00:55:39.740
Rick Boyd: obedience from the things we suffer.

579
00:55:40.230 --> 00:55:45.710
Rick Boyd: So so he is the Eternal Son who took on flesh. So when you read

580
00:55:46.108 --> 00:55:49.809
Rick Boyd: chapter one, verse 4, and I'm glad you decided to read that.

581
00:55:49.810 --> 00:55:50.959
Andy Miller III: I couldn't help myself. Yeah, yeah.

582
00:55:50.960 --> 00:55:52.600
Rick Boyd: I just grace the Lord.

583
00:55:53.677 --> 00:55:55.829
Rick Boyd: He became right.

584
00:55:56.240 --> 00:55:59.000
Rick Boyd: That's the way verse 4 reach. Read, read, read that again.

585
00:55:59.240 --> 00:56:02.939
Andy Miller III: Yeah. So he became as much superior to the angels

586
00:56:02.950 --> 00:56:07.470
Andy Miller III: as a name he has inherited is superior to theirs.

587
00:56:07.690 --> 00:56:11.449
Rick Boyd: Becoming something means it wasn't before.

588
00:56:13.420 --> 00:56:17.180
Rick Boyd: When you become something. It's something you were not before right.

589
00:56:17.180 --> 00:56:25.289
Andy Miller III: Okay, yeah, yeah, no. I agree. I struggle with that idea. You know, Rick, because I think it. Well, there, it sounds a little Aryan to me right right.

590
00:56:25.290 --> 00:56:26.760
Rick Boyd: But but get this.

591
00:56:27.220 --> 00:56:29.910
Rick Boyd: 5, 8. He is the eternal Son.

592
00:56:30.080 --> 00:56:30.740
Andy Miller III: Right.

593
00:56:31.050 --> 00:56:35.529
Rick Boyd: And the book here. This book of Hebrews is about

594
00:56:35.750 --> 00:56:39.610
Rick Boyd: perfection of sun in the flesh.

595
00:56:40.850 --> 00:56:49.300
Rick Boyd: and so he is the Eternal Son who took on flesh. That's why 5, 7 begins with the words, in the days of his flesh.

596
00:56:49.690 --> 00:56:50.810
Andy Miller III: Okay. Okay.

597
00:56:51.250 --> 00:56:57.620
Rick Boyd: So it has to do with Jesus, the the Eternal Son, becoming Son in the flesh.

598
00:56:57.840 --> 00:56:58.430
Andy Miller III: Okay.

599
00:56:58.650 --> 00:57:00.509
Rick Boyd: Something he was not before.

600
00:57:01.160 --> 00:57:05.070
Rick Boyd: and in the process of doing that he perfected sunshine

601
00:57:05.230 --> 00:57:06.399
Rick Boyd: in the flesh.

602
00:57:07.270 --> 00:57:11.019
Rick Boyd: so we can be perfected, but only in Christ.

603
00:57:11.390 --> 00:57:12.220
Andy Miller III: Yes.

604
00:57:12.940 --> 00:57:14.169
Rick Boyd: And so helpful.

605
00:57:14.530 --> 00:57:15.759
Rick Boyd: Praise the Lord! Why.

606
00:57:15.760 --> 00:57:40.019
Andy Miller III: Let let me jump in. I know I know one of the things that when we talk about the obedience of Jesus, similar to the idea of Jesus being a son, and we being the arch, typical ark, boy rk, son. This the idea of Jesus being obedient, maybe some people might imply that he could have been disobedient. Nevertheless, like, do you get to this place where you think.

607
00:57:40.090 --> 00:57:44.639
Andy Miller III: if Jesus was obedient, this might help us understand some of the

608
00:57:44.830 --> 00:57:57.610
Andy Miller III: translations that are hard in other portions of Scripture, where there is objective and subjective genitive construction, so we would say, and this is a very controversial area at times where he's like the faith

609
00:57:57.750 --> 00:58:02.569
Andy Miller III: faith in Jesus, or the faith or faithfulness of Jesus.

610
00:58:03.030 --> 00:58:26.060
Andy Miller III: I find in general, when we think of the faithfulness of Jesus in Jesus' obedience. This communicates also, and more more than just, like thankful for the faith in Jesus like, I do trust Him, put my faith in Him, but that Jesus life is one that has gone ahead of us. And is this

611
00:58:26.170 --> 00:58:41.470
Andy Miller III: tiny or M. Perfect, but is also, and I like us to get there, still existent at the right hand of the Father, exalted to the right hand of the Father, interceded on our behalf. The faithfulness of Jesus is something that's still

612
00:58:41.911 --> 00:58:44.319
Andy Miller III: something that's operative for us now.

613
00:58:44.930 --> 00:58:51.750
Rick Boyd: Absolutely, and you'd mentioned something. I may up. I may ruffle a little feathers here, but let me but let me explain it.

614
00:58:52.614 --> 00:58:58.280
Rick Boyd: Was there a possibility for Jesus to fall and to fail and to be disobedient? Yes.

615
00:58:58.848 --> 00:59:04.939
Rick Boyd: if there was no possibility for that, he did not become fully human. Thank you. But he did.

616
00:59:04.980 --> 00:59:07.709
Rick Boyd: And yet the way Hebrews presents it.

617
00:59:08.070 --> 00:59:15.470
Rick Boyd: For again, verse 8, of chapter 5, although being a son, he learned, and it's articular.

618
00:59:15.490 --> 00:59:17.450
Rick Boyd: the obedience

619
00:59:18.040 --> 00:59:20.290
Rick Boyd: from what? From the things that he suffered.

620
00:59:21.550 --> 00:59:25.320
Rick Boyd: So there was an element of suffering that taught

621
00:59:25.330 --> 00:59:27.890
Rick Boyd: the obedience. There's only one obedience.

622
00:59:27.930 --> 00:59:29.820
Rick Boyd: and that's obedience to God.

623
00:59:30.100 --> 00:59:35.959
Rick Boyd: and that is what he learned in the flesh, but very important.

624
00:59:36.510 --> 00:59:44.150
Rick Boyd: In chapter 12 we have 1212, one through 13, the first, 13 verses of chapter 12

625
00:59:44.490 --> 00:59:48.650
Rick Boyd: says a lot about sonship about being a son or daughter of God.

626
00:59:49.980 --> 00:59:52.199
Rick Boyd: But there's a particular word that's used.

627
00:59:52.790 --> 00:59:54.239
Rick Boyd: and it's discipline.

628
00:59:54.570 --> 00:59:55.240
Rick Boyd: Hmm!

629
00:59:55.640 --> 00:59:58.200
Rick Boyd: This word, this Greek word paideia.

630
00:59:59.050 --> 01:00:00.870
Rick Boyd: and this Greek word.

631
01:00:01.130 --> 01:00:08.749
Rick Boyd: This is amazing. This Greek word is what the child of God must endure. According to the text of Hebrew.

632
01:00:10.040 --> 01:00:10.910
Rick Boyd: He boobs.

633
01:00:11.240 --> 01:00:14.000
Rick Boyd: but it's never used of Jesus.

634
01:00:14.320 --> 01:00:18.540
Rick Boyd: So Jesus learned obedience from the things he suffered.

635
01:00:18.620 --> 01:00:20.990
Rick Boyd: but he didn't need to be disciplined.

636
01:00:21.160 --> 01:00:22.409
Andy Miller III: Ok? He, still.

637
01:00:22.410 --> 01:00:23.659
Rick Boyd: Had to learn.

638
01:00:24.000 --> 01:00:25.969
Rick Boyd: We need the discipline.

639
01:00:26.320 --> 01:00:32.359
Rick Boyd: We need correction as we run the race with perseverance. There are things in us that are lame

640
01:00:32.560 --> 01:00:33.390
Rick Boyd: the egg.

641
01:00:34.060 --> 01:00:47.100
Rick Boyd: It's not that's not slang, oh, so lame, but actually something that's out of. So something that's wrong in us. There are things daily that we see that need transformation, that God can do it.

642
01:00:47.270 --> 01:00:49.550
Rick Boyd: and he's willing to do it if we are willing.

643
01:00:50.550 --> 01:00:58.770
Rick Boyd: But that, in fact, that's what versus 12 and 13 of chapter 12 are about that if we participate with God in His discipline.

644
01:00:59.720 --> 01:01:04.939
Rick Boyd: he will heal what is lame in us. Jesus didn't have that

645
01:01:05.750 --> 01:01:07.840
Rick Boyd: Jesus fully human.

646
01:01:07.960 --> 01:01:12.609
Rick Boyd: Chapter 4. Says, tempted in every way, we are yet without sin.

647
01:01:12.610 --> 01:01:13.380
Andy Miller III: Without sin.

648
01:01:13.730 --> 01:01:15.919
Rick Boyd: He lived the fully human life.

649
01:01:16.420 --> 01:01:18.289
Rick Boyd: but he didn't need correction.

650
01:01:18.600 --> 01:01:20.430
Rick Boyd: and he perfected

651
01:01:20.740 --> 01:01:24.399
Rick Boyd: humanity, predicted, perfected the human.

652
01:01:25.070 --> 01:01:28.759
Rick Boyd: And so we then run the same race.

653
01:01:29.140 --> 01:01:32.749
Rick Boyd: but we do it, fixing our eyes on Jesus, who is.

654
01:01:32.810 --> 01:01:38.720
Rick Boyd: And this is the way the text reads the pioneer and the perfecter of the faith.

655
01:01:39.640 --> 01:01:41.410
Rick Boyd: It's not our faith.

656
01:01:41.580 --> 01:01:45.849
Rick Boyd: it's not faith in general, it is the faith. What faith?

657
01:01:46.330 --> 01:01:48.180
Rick Boyd: Read. Chapter 11.

658
01:01:48.360 --> 01:01:58.949
Rick Boyd: We've just come through a whole chapter of by faith, able by faith, Enic by faith, Noah by faith, Abraham, and on and on and on and on. It's the same faith. But the thing is.

659
01:01:59.150 --> 01:02:01.629
Rick Boyd: they lived by faith.

660
01:02:01.740 --> 01:02:03.420
Rick Boyd: looking forward

661
01:02:03.660 --> 01:02:08.289
Rick Boyd: to the coming of Jesus, and it says, all of these died without receiving the promise.

662
01:02:08.420 --> 01:02:11.829
Rick Boyd: and they would not be made perfect

663
01:02:11.920 --> 01:02:13.959
Rick Boyd: apart from us.

664
01:02:14.600 --> 01:02:21.260
Rick Boyd: or God had something better in mind for us. It's the coming of Jesus, so that Jesus can be the pioneer in the perfect

665
01:02:21.330 --> 01:02:22.450
Rick Boyd: of defect.

666
01:02:22.490 --> 01:02:23.710
Rick Boyd: That's who he is.

667
01:02:24.000 --> 01:02:26.130
Rick Boyd: So he lived a fully human life.

668
01:02:26.280 --> 01:02:30.959
Rick Boyd: and he's the one that we then, under the discipline of God as Father.

669
01:02:31.640 --> 01:02:39.029
Rick Boyd: We run the race as well, and as we cooperate with God's discipline, it's a hard thing to to hear.

670
01:02:39.060 --> 01:02:41.640
Rick Boyd: but as we cooperate with his discipline.

671
01:02:41.810 --> 01:02:44.159
Rick Boyd: what is lame in us is actually being.

672
01:02:44.680 --> 01:02:56.589
Andy Miller III: Amen! Amen. Oh, Rick, this is beautiful! I love just a way that we're seeing how these images, which might not be a part of the common parlance of our regular

673
01:02:56.590 --> 01:03:21.199
Andy Miller III: kind of Christian culture might be something that invigorates our orthodoxy. It gives us an opportunity to express things in a way that shows the victorious life like we we often talk about here in the hallways, Wesley Biblical Seminary that we don't want to just talk about us getting our sins forgiven, and then, you know, we'll get it. Go to heaven. Someday, when we die. Not that we don't believe in such things. We could. We could pull out together.

674
01:03:22.260 --> 01:03:32.289
Andy Miller III: instead. It's this full, the opportunity, the the the gospel message is opportunity for the full restoration of humanity

675
01:03:32.530 --> 01:04:01.999
Andy Miller III: back into the image for which we were created. So I think, like the this language and thinking of this is the focus of Hebrews, is helpful. I want to read averse from a hymn, and then I'll say, before I ask a question about Mel Kizadick, I want to give you a little warning. I'm coming from Melchizedek so, but it's a great him. That! And honestly it could sound every now and then before I even had this this foundation. Honestly, Rick, some of the influence you've been on me

676
01:04:02.070 --> 01:04:18.889
Andy Miller III: to think through this. It almost sounded pantheistic at times, and maybe there are some parts about it, but it's joyful, joyful. The third verse says, this, thou art giving and forgiving, ever blessing, ever bless, wellspring of the joy of living ocean, depth of happy rest.

677
01:04:18.940 --> 01:04:20.469
Andy Miller III: thou, our Father.

678
01:04:20.610 --> 01:04:22.410
Andy Miller III: Christ, our brother.

679
01:04:22.730 --> 01:04:47.634
Andy Miller III: All who live in love are Thine. Teach us how to love each other, lift us to the joy divine. There we have it. We have this this image of Christ our brother. Now, one of the ways that this is this contrast is made comes through this interesting chapter. It will when verse 7, verse 7, chapter 7, and

680
01:04:48.090 --> 01:04:59.099
Andy Miller III: and then moving a little bit. Well, basically it comes. A little ahead of that in Chapter 6, where there's kind of a introduction of the idea of Mel Kizad. But there's this character, Mel Kizode.

681
01:04:59.200 --> 01:05:08.329
Andy Miller III: Jesus is contrasted with Melchizedek, based upon this image of of him being a son. But help us understand how that contrast

682
01:05:08.390 --> 01:05:10.530
Andy Miller III: is explicated.

683
01:05:11.020 --> 01:05:14.040
Rick Boyd: Now you're talking about a contrast between Jesus and Melchizedek.

684
01:05:14.040 --> 01:05:15.320
Andy Miller III: Am I wrong? There.

685
01:05:15.320 --> 01:05:17.462
Rick Boyd: Yeah, it's not a contrast. It's a comparison.

686
01:05:17.730 --> 01:05:20.249
Andy Miller III: So I was. I said, Okay, forgive me. Wrong word.

687
01:05:20.250 --> 01:05:21.435
Rick Boyd: That's okay. But

688
01:05:21.960 --> 01:05:24.650
Rick Boyd: the the thing about the the Melchizedek

689
01:05:24.730 --> 01:05:27.260
Rick Boyd: Jesus comparison.

690
01:05:27.280 --> 01:05:31.360
Rick Boyd: Jesus is high priest in the order of Melchizedek.

691
01:05:31.510 --> 01:05:32.240
Andy Miller III: Gotcha.

692
01:05:32.240 --> 01:05:35.800
Rick Boyd: But notice. No, Kizza deck is never called High Priest.

693
01:05:36.020 --> 01:05:37.180
Rick Boyd: He is priest.

694
01:05:37.640 --> 01:05:39.360
Rick Boyd: and I think that's significant

695
01:05:39.690 --> 01:05:42.540
Rick Boyd: because Melchizedek is priest.

696
01:05:43.700 --> 01:05:50.430
Rick Boyd: doesn't. There's no beginning and no ending. There's no genealogy. There's that's what we see at the beginning of Chapter 7

697
01:05:50.700 --> 01:05:55.160
Rick Boyd: is without mother, without father, because he's not presented that way.

698
01:05:55.540 --> 01:05:57.670
Rick Boyd: And Jesus same way.

699
01:05:57.880 --> 01:06:02.400
Rick Boyd: without mother, without father, without genealogy. It's not about the biological

700
01:06:03.285 --> 01:06:05.310
Rick Boyd: legacy of Jesus.

701
01:06:05.380 --> 01:06:07.990
Rick Boyd: It is about the faith legacy

702
01:06:08.230 --> 01:06:08.770
Rick Boyd: of you.

703
01:06:09.130 --> 01:06:09.460
Rick Boyd: Those.

704
01:06:09.460 --> 01:06:10.050
Andy Miller III: Okay. Okay.

705
01:06:10.050 --> 01:06:11.689
Rick Boyd: Follow him in faith.

706
01:06:12.170 --> 01:06:16.030
Rick Boyd: Melchizedek was a priest with the forever priesthood.

707
01:06:16.160 --> 01:06:19.069
Rick Boyd: But Jesus is high priest.

708
01:06:19.730 --> 01:06:20.560
Andy Miller III: Okay. Okay.

709
01:06:20.560 --> 01:06:24.859
Rick Boyd: And he's forever high Priest, and you made mention of.

710
01:06:25.050 --> 01:06:28.710
Rick Boyd: and I think, through the hymn, but Jesus being

711
01:06:28.950 --> 01:06:34.059
Rick Boyd: our forever salvation, I mean, he's the one who saves, which is 7, 25.

712
01:06:34.140 --> 01:06:35.719
Rick Boyd: It's in that same chapter.

713
01:06:36.490 --> 01:06:42.610
Rick Boyd: But this is one of those words that can be translated. Number well, a couple of different ways.

714
01:06:42.770 --> 01:06:43.620
Rick Boyd: palm.

715
01:06:44.040 --> 01:06:48.510
Rick Boyd: whence also Jesus is able to save

716
01:06:48.640 --> 01:06:51.390
Rick Boyd: some translation safe for all time.

717
01:06:53.040 --> 01:06:56.924
Rick Boyd: But the King James says to the uttermost.

718
01:06:57.900 --> 01:07:01.789
Rick Boyd: and I believe, because it's the word Pontelus

719
01:07:02.440 --> 01:07:03.320
Rick Boyd: and

720
01:07:03.450 --> 01:07:04.200
Rick Boyd: the

721
01:07:04.700 --> 01:07:06.020
Rick Boyd: cognate

722
01:07:06.250 --> 01:07:07.510
Rick Boyd: tell us.

723
01:07:08.190 --> 01:07:09.530
Rick Boyd: Teleos.

724
01:07:10.470 --> 01:07:15.460
Rick Boyd: these mean, perfect, or complete, or end or goal.

725
01:07:15.890 --> 01:07:18.920
Rick Boyd: that Jesus is able to sing

726
01:07:19.220 --> 01:07:20.470
Rick Boyd: completely.

727
01:07:21.250 --> 01:07:25.180
Rick Boyd: and we talk in in our tradition about entire sanctification.

728
01:07:25.680 --> 01:07:31.989
Rick Boyd: And it is the ministry, the ongoing ministry, because he lives to make intercession

729
01:07:32.030 --> 01:07:33.560
Rick Boyd: for those coming to go through him.

730
01:07:33.900 --> 01:07:37.860
Rick Boyd: that it is as an ongoing ministry of sanctification

731
01:07:38.490 --> 01:07:40.440
Rick Boyd: that Jesus has now.

732
01:07:40.510 --> 01:07:43.240
Rick Boyd: for all those who are willing to follow after

733
01:07:44.170 --> 01:07:46.089
Rick Boyd: 2 distinct verses

734
01:07:46.460 --> 01:07:50.640
Rick Boyd: in chapter 2, verse 11 and chapter 10, verse 14.

735
01:07:51.020 --> 01:07:54.029
Rick Boyd: This, the the wording is identical

736
01:07:54.160 --> 01:07:57.359
Rick Boyd: for those who are being sanctified.

737
01:07:59.200 --> 01:08:01.670
Rick Boyd: and it's an ongoing, it's present participant.

738
01:08:02.158 --> 01:08:07.589
Rick Boyd: and it's passive. So those who are being sanctified that Jesus is the pioneer

739
01:08:07.770 --> 01:08:09.380
Rick Boyd: of the salvation

740
01:08:09.550 --> 01:08:16.479
Rick Boyd: of all those, some of many sons and daughters. The next verse says, for both, the one sanctifying.

741
01:08:16.740 --> 01:08:18.089
Rick Boyd: referring to Jesus.

742
01:08:18.100 --> 01:08:20.839
Rick Boyd: and those being sanctified

743
01:08:21.670 --> 01:08:26.529
Rick Boyd: are from one. Therefore he's not ashamed, called them brothers. That's chapter 2,

744
01:08:26.840 --> 01:08:28.470
Rick Boyd: and then chapter 10.

745
01:08:28.930 --> 01:08:31.380
Rick Boyd: And this is a grade, verse 14,

746
01:08:31.410 --> 01:08:33.410
Rick Boyd: for by one offering.

747
01:08:34.350 --> 01:08:38.210
Rick Boyd: and this is, I believe, the offering of the whole life of Jesus

748
01:08:38.830 --> 01:08:40.510
Rick Boyd: by one offering

749
01:08:40.529 --> 01:08:44.489
Rick Boyd: he has perfected. It's perfect tense.

750
01:08:44.490 --> 01:08:45.040
Andy Miller III: Okay.

751
01:08:45.040 --> 01:08:47.060
Rick Boyd: Which means it's a completed event.

752
01:08:47.550 --> 01:08:49.560
Rick Boyd: He has perfected

753
01:08:50.330 --> 01:08:54.300
Rick Boyd: continuously those being sanctified.

754
01:08:55.520 --> 01:08:58.149
Rick Boyd: So we have both a completed event

755
01:08:58.740 --> 01:09:02.490
Rick Boyd: and an ongoing issue which is sanctification.

756
01:09:02.660 --> 01:09:03.500
Andy Miller III: Yes.

757
01:09:03.640 --> 01:09:05.560
Rick Boyd: So in Christ's

758
01:09:05.920 --> 01:09:08.369
Rick Boyd: life, in the flesh as sun.

759
01:09:08.770 --> 01:09:10.529
Rick Boyd: he has perfected

760
01:09:10.670 --> 01:09:13.290
Rick Boyd: those who are being sanctified.

761
01:09:13.350 --> 01:09:20.310
Rick Boyd: and I hate to keep bouncing around here. But you need the full context of this. That's why we need about 5 h with the.

762
01:09:20.319 --> 01:09:28.539
Andy Miller III: I know we don't need 5 h. You do this, and how many hours? 40 h of lecturing that you're doing on Hebrews this this semester. So.

763
01:09:28.540 --> 01:09:29.100
Rick Boyd: Something like.

764
01:09:29.109 --> 01:09:30.549
Andy Miller III: That's not even enough.

765
01:09:30.550 --> 01:09:37.520
Rick Boyd: Well, because I'm teaching the method. I don't have time to dig into this stuff. But this, this is great. In chapter 2, verse 3.

766
01:09:37.660 --> 01:09:42.819
Rick Boyd: Yeah, there is a reference to so great a salvation. Yes.

767
01:09:42.840 --> 01:09:45.660
Rick Boyd: if we neglect so great a salvation.

768
01:09:46.439 --> 01:09:52.170
Rick Boyd: if we understand that without getting too much further into the depth of this

769
01:09:52.450 --> 01:09:55.079
Rick Boyd: I believe in, in, just in my study.

770
01:09:55.290 --> 01:09:59.319
Rick Boyd: that that great salvation is actually the relationship

771
01:09:59.600 --> 01:10:04.219
Rick Boyd: that comes through Christ, our relationship to God as Father.

772
01:10:04.710 --> 01:10:17.330
Rick Boyd: where we are actually the sons and daughters of God. And that's how God has spoken to us in these last days. Yes, yes, so in the person of Jesus. He has spoken in the form of sonship

773
01:10:17.720 --> 01:10:21.070
Rick Boyd: to where we can now receive this great salvation.

774
01:10:21.440 --> 01:10:23.690
Rick Boyd: but we better not neglect it.

775
01:10:24.490 --> 01:10:26.779
Rick Boyd: because, according to Chapter 12,

776
01:10:26.900 --> 01:10:31.929
Rick Boyd: if anyone does not remain under discipline of God the Father.

777
01:10:32.220 --> 01:10:35.360
Rick Boyd: if we choose. This is too hard. I'm not going to do it.

778
01:10:35.961 --> 01:10:39.720
Rick Boyd: And that's often the case. If people turn off the pathway.

779
01:10:40.110 --> 01:10:45.579
Rick Boyd: we are not genuine sons and daughters, we are illegitimate, is what it says.

780
01:10:46.340 --> 01:10:51.479
Rick Boyd: So Christ gives us all we need by the presence of the Holy Spirit.

781
01:10:52.280 --> 01:10:56.530
Rick Boyd: but we have the responsibility of continuing to run the race.

782
01:10:56.560 --> 01:11:00.000
Rick Boyd: I've used this example a couple of times I'll stop with this.

783
01:11:00.577 --> 01:11:06.010
Rick Boyd: I I can think of 2 New Testament examples of running a race.

784
01:11:06.580 --> 01:11:08.480
Rick Boyd: We've got first Corinthians, 9

785
01:11:08.920 --> 01:11:13.200
Rick Boyd: in a race. Many run, but only one gets the prize, Paul says.

786
01:11:13.300 --> 01:11:15.789
Rick Boyd: so run in such a way as to get the prize

787
01:11:16.300 --> 01:11:18.550
Rick Boyd: in Hebrews. Chapter 12.

788
01:11:18.820 --> 01:11:20.920
Rick Boyd: The writer doesn't care about us

789
01:11:21.490 --> 01:11:25.430
Rick Boyd: winning the race. That's not the point of the racing analogy.

790
01:11:26.090 --> 01:11:28.400
Rick Boyd: We have to finish the race.

791
01:11:29.050 --> 01:11:31.020
Rick Boyd: Christ has won the race.

792
01:11:31.250 --> 01:11:31.950
Andy Miller III: Right.

793
01:11:32.310 --> 01:11:33.850
Rick Boyd: And in a very.

794
01:11:33.870 --> 01:11:37.730
Rick Boyd: I don't like to use this this analog, this part of it.

795
01:11:37.760 --> 01:11:39.420
Rick Boyd: because it's too common

796
01:11:39.830 --> 01:11:41.539
Rick Boyd: for the holiness of Christ.

797
01:11:41.750 --> 01:11:43.619
Rick Boyd: but we're on his team.

798
01:11:44.545 --> 01:11:45.210
Andy Miller III: you know.

799
01:11:45.210 --> 01:11:48.410
Rick Boyd: He's so much more than just. You know the captain of our team.

800
01:11:49.287 --> 01:11:53.950
Rick Boyd: But anyway, he has won the race. But we have to keep running.

801
01:11:54.100 --> 01:11:54.940
Rick Boyd: Yes.

802
01:11:55.070 --> 01:11:59.919
Rick Boyd: and and he gives us a strength to do that. And one more thing for your brother

803
01:12:00.110 --> 01:12:01.380
Rick Boyd: about this.

804
01:12:02.350 --> 01:12:06.079
Rick Boyd: There's there's another theme that runs throughout the whole book of Hebrews.

805
01:12:06.190 --> 01:12:08.150
Rick Boyd: and that is the word encouragement.

806
01:12:09.730 --> 01:12:11.930
Rick Boyd: In chapter 3, verse 13,

807
01:12:12.467 --> 01:12:15.630
Rick Boyd: encourage one another daily as long as it is called today.

808
01:12:15.830 --> 01:12:19.210
Rick Boyd: so that none of you would be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin.

809
01:12:19.430 --> 01:12:27.889
Rick Boyd: That's just one of a number of occurrences in Chapter 10, when we are told to not stop meeting, to not

810
01:12:28.090 --> 01:12:32.459
Rick Boyd: quit meeting together as summer in the habit of doing, but encourage

811
01:12:32.510 --> 01:12:37.360
Rick Boyd: one another, and all the more, as you see today approachable. This concept of encouraging.

812
01:12:37.500 --> 01:12:39.769
Rick Boyd: I believe I believe so strongly

813
01:12:39.790 --> 01:12:45.880
Rick Boyd: what running the race? We're not running it alone. I preaches and chapel. I think you might have been gone that day.

814
01:12:46.080 --> 01:12:46.940
Andy Miller III: Forgive me!

815
01:12:47.280 --> 01:12:49.721
Rick Boyd: Oh, that's okay. That's just that's okay.

816
01:12:50.260 --> 01:12:57.110
Rick Boyd: and I don't think it was recorded either. So, but but the essence of it is, we do not run this race alone.

817
01:12:58.220 --> 01:13:04.169
Rick Boyd: and so we need to be encouraging one another that is, calling one another alongside.

818
01:13:04.200 --> 01:13:10.990
Rick Boyd: saying, Let's keep going. Don't quit. I know it's hard now, and you and I both know we have students

819
01:13:11.230 --> 01:13:13.229
Rick Boyd: who are undergoing terrible things.

820
01:13:13.410 --> 01:13:15.570
Rick Boyd: We have a student in Haiti right now.

821
01:13:16.840 --> 01:13:19.800
Rick Boyd: He's living outside of Port a prince.

822
01:13:20.360 --> 01:13:22.769
Rick Boyd: I just had a conversation with him a week ago.

823
01:13:23.292 --> 01:13:29.549
Rick Boyd: He's living outside of port, a prince which is all kinds of things are going on there. Gangs are running

824
01:13:29.670 --> 01:13:30.740
Rick Boyd: like that city.

825
01:13:30.740 --> 01:13:32.039
Andy Miller III: Awful situation.

826
01:13:32.210 --> 01:13:35.890
Rick Boyd: And even though he and his brothers and sisters

827
01:13:36.220 --> 01:13:37.560
Rick Boyd: in Christ

828
01:13:37.620 --> 01:13:40.179
Rick Boyd: are safe in the compound where they are.

829
01:13:41.320 --> 01:13:42.040
Rick Boyd: but

830
01:13:42.390 --> 01:13:44.869
Rick Boyd: they get their supplies from Port a prince.

831
01:13:46.440 --> 01:13:49.779
Rick Boyd: and so they don't have access to supplies.

832
01:13:51.100 --> 01:13:52.270
Rick Boyd: plus the fact

833
01:13:52.400 --> 01:13:56.200
Rick Boyd: that Jean Marie's family

834
01:13:56.610 --> 01:13:59.320
Rick Boyd: is still in port aprints.

835
01:13:59.730 --> 01:14:02.009
Rick Boyd: and they need to get out, and they can't.

836
01:14:03.310 --> 01:14:08.650
Rick Boyd: Now. Those are dire situations, but we keep running the race.

837
01:14:08.830 --> 01:14:09.620
Andy Miller III: Right.

838
01:14:09.620 --> 01:14:18.020
Rick Boyd: And we encourage one another. We pray for one another, we help as the Lord leads us financially material in other ways. You know

839
01:14:18.390 --> 01:14:21.489
Rick Boyd: he's called us to do that because we're running the race together

840
01:14:21.630 --> 01:14:23.309
Rick Boyd: right? And I think that's good.

841
01:14:23.310 --> 01:14:40.140
Andy Miller III: Yeah, it's be. And this is kind of the image of what the the so-called faith Hall of Fame is about is like. By faith. These people anticipated something objectively that could come. The the example that I preach on recently, by faith, Joseph anticipated

842
01:14:40.140 --> 01:15:09.240
Andy Miller III: that his bones, you know, would make it. I I I'm I could find the the passage, but altogether like he believed something was going to happen even beyond this life. And so we're we're kind of pointing to the reality of what Jesus has already won. Jesus has already accomplished. But yet there is this progressive dimension of what's happening along the way. So not only has that happened, but because Jesus is enthroned at the right hand of the Father

843
01:15:09.330 --> 01:15:19.459
Andy Miller III: as a pioneer and perfector, he is still working, and when the wild ideas which I think I hadn't thought of till probably 10 or 15 years ago

844
01:15:19.510 --> 01:15:22.709
Andy Miller III: well, into serving as a full time pastor.

845
01:15:22.860 --> 01:15:25.999
Andy Miller III: was that Jesus still has a body.

846
01:15:26.140 --> 01:15:30.890
Andy Miller III: Jesus is like his perfected or resurrected body

847
01:15:31.150 --> 01:15:34.040
Andy Miller III: is at the right hand of the Father interceding.

848
01:15:34.426 --> 01:15:37.189
Andy Miller III: Behalf like this is still something that is going on.

849
01:15:38.370 --> 01:15:40.669
Rick Boyd: You know, one of one of the parts of that

850
01:15:41.390 --> 01:15:44.890
Rick Boyd: and I think there's evidence I need to look into this more

851
01:15:44.970 --> 01:15:47.910
Rick Boyd: is the concept of intercession from 7, 25.

852
01:15:48.360 --> 01:15:52.749
Rick Boyd: You know where he's living to make intercession for those who are coming to God.

853
01:15:53.246 --> 01:15:57.449
Rick Boyd: Because I I'm wondering if intercession. I I'm thinking

854
01:15:57.520 --> 01:16:00.760
Rick Boyd: intercession is not merely a one-way street.

855
01:16:01.100 --> 01:16:01.760
Rick Boyd: Hmm.

856
01:16:02.160 --> 01:16:05.599
Rick Boyd: Jesus is at the right hand of the throne of God.

857
01:16:05.660 --> 01:16:07.710
Rick Boyd: the right hand of his Father.

858
01:16:09.110 --> 01:16:12.480
Rick Boyd: is he just offering up prayers to his Father?

859
01:16:13.030 --> 01:16:16.079
Rick Boyd: It seems like Jesus. Ministry is more than that.

860
01:16:16.270 --> 01:16:19.259
Rick Boyd: The intercessory ministry is 2 ways.

861
01:16:19.800 --> 01:16:24.780
Rick Boyd: It is interceding for us with the Father. But it's also

862
01:16:25.040 --> 01:16:26.690
Rick Boyd: talking to us.

863
01:16:26.810 --> 01:16:28.860
Rick Boyd: It's directing us.

864
01:16:29.000 --> 01:16:31.799
Rick Boyd: So all who are obedient to him.

865
01:16:31.900 --> 01:16:34.020
Rick Boyd: he becomes the source of salvation.

866
01:16:34.410 --> 01:16:36.729
Rick Boyd: That's that's chapter 5, verse 9.

867
01:16:36.830 --> 01:16:43.140
Rick Boyd: And so it's his ministry is going both ways. It's not merely to intercede with the Father.

868
01:16:43.230 --> 01:16:49.610
Rick Boyd: but it's also to speak to us to direct us, to lead us, to purify us, to sanctify us.

869
01:16:50.040 --> 01:16:55.819
Rick Boyd: It's all of that. Jesus is very active. We need Him every moment of every day.

870
01:16:55.960 --> 01:16:58.929
Rick Boyd: It's what Paul would say is being in crimes.

871
01:16:58.930 --> 01:16:59.610
Andy Miller III: Yes.

872
01:17:00.210 --> 01:17:01.400
Andy Miller III: I

873
01:17:01.440 --> 01:17:12.960
Andy Miller III: Rick, one of the things, I wonder is you? You've read anything that you can, and I know that you took a Sabbatical, where you just updated yourself, made sure you're aware of the most recent research on Hebrews.

874
01:17:12.960 --> 01:17:13.799
Rick Boyd: Stuck behind me.

875
01:17:13.800 --> 01:17:29.680
Andy Miller III: That's right, it's all there. Oh, I what's not? Not that it has to be, because because some people might say, Oh, all this sounds familiar. But I I think that there's a unique approach that you're bringing. What what is it that hasn't happened in book of the Book of Hebrew scholarship.

876
01:17:30.121 --> 01:17:32.790
Andy Miller III: That that you're doing here. That's distinct.

877
01:17:33.090 --> 01:17:42.449
Rick Boyd: Well, there, there are a couple of things. One is the the structure of the Book of Hebrews. I haven't seen anybody else who's identified this particular structure and structural relationships.

878
01:17:42.530 --> 01:17:47.259
Rick Boyd: And actually, but you told me you wanted to talk to me. And this is what you wanted to talk about.

879
01:17:47.300 --> 01:18:02.730
Rick Boyd: I've got an article that was in Journal of Inductive Biblical Studies. It's a it's a journal, and it was published, I believe, in January 2017, which is the it's called the role of Hebrews, 1 one through 4 in the Book of Hebrews.

880
01:18:02.730 --> 01:18:03.280
Andy Miller III: Okay.

881
01:18:03.280 --> 01:18:14.429
Rick Boyd: That's one of the unique things is the fact that I see the structure. I can't get into it in detail, because we'll never get out of it. But I I think that's one of the things, the other being

882
01:18:14.440 --> 01:18:16.739
Rick Boyd: that salvation itself

883
01:18:17.060 --> 01:18:18.760
Rick Boyd: is sunshine.

884
01:18:19.040 --> 01:18:20.250
Andy Miller III: Okay. Okay.

885
01:18:20.250 --> 01:18:23.159
Rick Boyd: So we can be saved now.

886
01:18:23.940 --> 01:18:33.660
Rick Boyd: but we are still in process of being saved. But we need to finish the race, and I know there's some theological traditions that would struggle with that.

887
01:18:34.060 --> 01:18:34.950
Rick Boyd: Well.

888
01:18:35.120 --> 01:18:41.959
Rick Boyd: better get used to it. That's what the text says. You know we are saved, and we are being saved.

889
01:18:42.780 --> 01:18:46.750
Rick Boyd: and those 2 things, I think, are probably the 2 that

890
01:18:46.900 --> 01:18:57.320
Rick Boyd: you know there have been like, I said, all the books behind me, except that top shelf. You see, Bart Carl Barton on down with theology and mission and various other things, but

891
01:18:57.340 --> 01:19:03.259
Rick Boyd: starting up below that top shelf, that's all Hebrews, and it actually wraps around the room.

892
01:19:03.420 --> 01:19:04.190
Andy Miller III: Okay.

893
01:19:04.190 --> 01:19:10.890
Rick Boyd: And so I've got a lot of Hebrew stuff I've read, tried to read everything on Hebrews. And that that's a big task.

894
01:19:11.080 --> 01:19:19.389
Rick Boyd: But regardless of that, I've seen scholars like Gb. Cared. Yeah, sure. And Lincoln Hearst.

895
01:19:19.660 --> 01:19:21.900
Rick Boyd: who was Gb. Cared's student.

896
01:19:22.180 --> 01:19:25.980
Rick Boyd: Those 2 have written on this kind of thing.

897
01:19:26.130 --> 01:19:27.610
Rick Boyd: but they didn't develop it.

898
01:19:28.719 --> 01:19:32.309
Rick Boyd: And I'm developing this in a much fuller way about

899
01:19:32.330 --> 01:19:36.820
Rick Boyd: not only what what this has to do with, but the implications of it.

900
01:19:37.300 --> 01:19:42.410
Rick Boyd: And that's where I'm going with all of this that I think can really help the church.

901
01:19:42.410 --> 01:19:43.000
Andy Miller III: Yes.

902
01:19:43.000 --> 01:19:46.320
Rick Boyd: You know I'm taking. I'm taking my very technical dissertation.

903
01:19:46.420 --> 01:19:53.490
Rick Boyd: Yeah. And I'm turning it into something that hopefully will be helpful beyond the Academy. Although the Academy is in view of this.

904
01:19:53.490 --> 01:19:54.220
Andy Miller III: Yes.

905
01:19:54.320 --> 01:20:21.740
Andy Miller III: Well, for for sure. Well, well, brother, I appreciate your time and and your passion for this, and it just a little bit of a taste here that people may get of Dr. Boyd's ministry and his dedication to Studying God's Word. But one thing you might not see here is just dedicate. Well, actually, you did. You heard his passion for our students, who are in difficult situations, but serving students and and wanting to

906
01:20:21.740 --> 01:20:48.180
Andy Miller III: communicate the depth and power of God toward. I think, Rick, this idea is not something we hear a lot salvation as sonship. This is an emphasis that within the whole administration speaks volume. I mean, it just fits right in with the full restoration of us being able to be as as you said. Oh, I can't remember where it is, save to the uttermost, save completely. You know this this picture? Where is what? Versus that.

907
01:20:48.180 --> 01:20:49.830
Rick Boyd: 7, 7, 25.

908
01:20:49.830 --> 01:20:50.289
Andy Miller III: Oh, awesome!

909
01:20:50.290 --> 01:20:57.470
Rick Boyd: 7, 7, 25, and it is the perfection. Again, it's this word perfection that is absent from that first verse.

910
01:20:57.490 --> 01:21:02.419
Rick Boyd: but I think, or second verse, but I think intentionally, I think that's the point

911
01:21:02.520 --> 01:21:05.040
Rick Boyd: that God has spoken perfection.

912
01:21:05.250 --> 01:21:07.919
Rick Boyd: that is completion, perfect salvation.

913
01:21:07.980 --> 01:21:10.919
Rick Boyd: and that salvation is the relationship.

914
01:21:10.980 --> 01:21:14.079
Rick Boyd: No. And the writer actually stops his argument

915
01:21:14.190 --> 01:21:20.349
Rick Boyd: in chapter 5. Now I have much more to say about this. No pizza thing, and what's going on. But

916
01:21:20.730 --> 01:21:24.159
Rick Boyd: you're not ready because you are dull in hearing.

917
01:21:24.600 --> 01:21:29.010
Rick Boyd: and so he's trying to get their attention, saying you are in danger

918
01:21:29.480 --> 01:21:31.689
Rick Boyd: of losing that relationship

919
01:21:32.160 --> 01:21:35.809
Rick Boyd: because you're you're talking about turning off.

920
01:21:36.080 --> 01:21:43.979
Rick Boyd: I've just. I'm working through my Hebrews class right now in Ibs in that passage 5, 11 to 6, 8, 5, 11 to 6 20.

921
01:21:44.180 --> 01:21:48.230
Rick Boyd: And so I'm I'm very. I'm embedded in that right now.

922
01:21:48.350 --> 01:21:50.300
Rick Boyd: We are saved now.

923
01:21:50.510 --> 01:21:51.360
Rick Boyd: Yes.

924
01:21:51.520 --> 01:21:58.329
Rick Boyd: if we receive Christ, but we need to keep running the race. That's why it's so essential for us to finish the race.

925
01:21:59.810 --> 01:22:00.640
Andy Miller III: Beautiful.

926
01:22:00.660 --> 01:22:12.970
Andy Miller III: Rick. One thing I often do at my Podcast is is called more to the story, and and I think that that fits in with this emphasis of what you're saying saved and being saved, there's more, there's more coming. We need to finish the race.

927
01:22:13.230 --> 01:22:32.219
Andy Miller III: But I also like to think of it as this. For my guests? I asked more to the story question. So is there more the story of Rick than maybe some of your students or other people here on a regular basis. I know you have some hobbies or some things you enjoy doing. Tell us a little bit a little bit more about Rick. What's more to the story of Rick.

928
01:22:33.860 --> 01:22:39.469
Rick Boyd: I when I was born again? And I I came to this realization about a year in.

929
01:22:40.415 --> 01:22:42.159
Rick Boyd: We're living in Havana.

930
01:22:42.700 --> 01:22:43.424
Rick Boyd: and

931
01:22:45.200 --> 01:22:48.959
Rick Boyd: You may not be familiar with this terminology, but puddle jumpers.

932
01:22:49.150 --> 01:22:55.850
Rick Boyd: These are these tiny planes, you know. They're bigger than the bigger than assess number, you know they only seat about 20 people.

933
01:22:55.940 --> 01:23:00.429
Rick Boyd: and that was the only way to fly anywhere in the country was, take a puddle jumper

934
01:23:00.570 --> 01:23:15.466
Rick Boyd: from Urban's Willard Airport champions, Willard Airport up to O'hare Connect, and then I could go to Albuquerque. Then I could go to Phoenix or Seattle, or Orlando, wherever I flew all over the place.

935
01:23:16.220 --> 01:23:20.930
Rick Boyd: We were coming in back into Champaigner Band. I was done with a business trip.

936
01:23:21.410 --> 01:23:22.400
Rick Boyd: and

937
01:23:22.570 --> 01:23:23.450
Rick Boyd: PA

938
01:23:23.670 --> 01:23:28.060
Rick Boyd: the the plane, because it's so light is jumping around

939
01:23:28.160 --> 01:23:33.250
Rick Boyd: because of the buffeting winds in Illinois, Central Illinois. There's nothing to stop the winds.

940
01:23:33.520 --> 01:23:43.790
Rick Boyd: and I'm looking around. I'm I'm about. I don't know like I said, about a year old in the Lord, and I'm looking around at my fellow passengers, and I can see white knuckles.

941
01:23:44.170 --> 01:23:46.650
Rick Boyd: You know. People are holding on for dear life.

942
01:23:46.750 --> 01:23:49.780
Rick Boyd: and I was filled with peace.

943
01:23:49.780 --> 01:23:50.640
Andy Miller III: Interesting.

944
01:23:50.960 --> 01:23:52.010
Rick Boyd: Because

945
01:23:52.510 --> 01:23:56.340
Rick Boyd: if we make it back, praise the Lord, I get to be with Jodie again.

946
01:23:56.920 --> 01:24:02.270
Rick Boyd: But if we die in the plane, praise the Lord, I'm in the presence of the Lord.

947
01:24:02.580 --> 01:24:07.600
Rick Boyd: and I had so much peace. Well, that brother has dominated my life.

948
01:24:08.496 --> 01:24:10.629
Rick Boyd: When I got too old

949
01:24:10.690 --> 01:24:16.840
Rick Boyd: I became injured, and and such to play softball. So it was no longer a minister. I coach for a while, but

950
01:24:17.010 --> 01:24:17.860
Rick Boyd: Palm.

951
01:24:18.130 --> 01:24:20.390
Rick Boyd: I still had interest in that.

952
01:24:20.720 --> 01:24:22.040
Rick Boyd: But really

953
01:24:22.450 --> 01:24:31.469
Rick Boyd: my time is spent in the word. I I love doing that, Jodi. And I'll go to movies from time to time. We just saw a movie called Cabrini.

954
01:24:31.780 --> 01:24:32.460
Andy Miller III: Okay.

955
01:24:32.630 --> 01:24:35.029
Rick Boyd: And that's an it's an interesting movie.

956
01:24:35.390 --> 01:24:37.650
Rick Boyd: It's about a nun who had.

957
01:24:37.650 --> 01:24:38.550
Andy Miller III: Oh, right!

958
01:24:38.690 --> 01:24:39.540
Rick Boyd: Okay, yeah.

959
01:24:39.760 --> 01:24:43.739
Rick Boyd: And there are some. There are some issues with that that I have.

960
01:24:44.000 --> 01:24:49.439
Rick Boyd: We like to. We like to watch movies. We don't go to them very often. We went to this one

961
01:24:49.550 --> 01:24:51.630
Rick Boyd: recently, just to kind of.

962
01:24:51.630 --> 01:24:57.810
Andy Miller III: I'm a sports fan, too, right? Like you. You're go pulling for the line. I here in the Nca tournament. Right? Yeah.

963
01:24:58.160 --> 01:25:01.539
Rick Boyd: That. Yeah, that's my, that's my Alma mater.

964
01:25:01.670 --> 01:25:04.290
Rick Boyd: My engineering degree is from Illinois. And

965
01:25:04.340 --> 01:25:15.577
Rick Boyd: yeah, I got a really good engineering school. But yeah, I'm I'm I follow sports. I've I'm a Minnesota Vikings fan and so I've never known the sweet taste

966
01:25:17.191 --> 01:25:19.009
Rick Boyd: I suffered through.

967
01:25:20.030 --> 01:25:28.530
Rick Boyd: Yeah, I won't talk about that I suffer. I suffered through all 4 super bowl losses, but the last one was in January of 1,977.

968
01:25:29.280 --> 01:25:33.319
Rick Boyd: So we're coming up on the 50 year mark of even going to the Super Bowl.

969
01:25:33.660 --> 01:25:35.420
Rick Boyd: I'm a Vikings fan.

970
01:25:35.550 --> 01:25:38.440
Rick Boyd: but I don't watch any of the games.

971
01:25:38.510 --> 01:25:43.899
Rick Boyd: and I'm a lion, I fan, and I don't really watch any of those games. I've got too much to do.

972
01:25:43.900 --> 01:25:44.379
Andy Miller III: Yeah, well.

973
01:25:44.380 --> 01:25:45.029
Rick Boyd: Like, thank you.

974
01:25:45.030 --> 01:26:09.019
Andy Miller III: But you but you, I'll say, like you're being humble there, and and very godly. But you do know what's going on in those teams, and you know the the Vikings. It'll be interesting this year if they draft a quarterback, you know, we'll see what happened. They got a good coach. My mom is a Vikings fan, even though I was a bears fan purple Pete people, eaters all of that. Yeah, very close, like I'm I'm very well aware. So we'll see what happens for your teams.

975
01:26:09.020 --> 01:26:10.850
Rick Boyd: How did your mom become a Vikings.

976
01:26:10.850 --> 01:26:21.489
Andy Miller III: Oh, she's from that region. So she well, she lived her my grandparents were savage army officers. They moved around they had several appointments in the Upper Midwest

977
01:26:21.520 --> 01:26:48.256
Andy Miller III: South Dakota, North Dakota. My grandmother is from Wisconsin, so I think that that was part of it is that when she was, and she graduated high school in Williston, North Dakota. So she was in that in that region. So I think probably that has something to do with it? But my my parents used to my dad would dress me up in bears, clothes, and then I would somehow pull away. In the second half I'd be dressed up in Vikings clothes so.

978
01:26:48.888 --> 01:26:54.480
Rick Boyd: Yeah, I I was a transplant. I became a Vikings fan. When I grew up in California.

979
01:26:54.480 --> 01:26:55.060
Andy Miller III: But.

980
01:26:55.060 --> 01:27:00.459
Rick Boyd: When I went to high school it was in Saint Joseph, Illinois bears country.

981
01:27:00.460 --> 01:27:01.200
Andy Miller III: Yeah, sure.

982
01:27:01.200 --> 01:27:04.040
Rick Boyd: And so I was the only Vikings fan in my high school.

983
01:27:04.210 --> 01:27:08.169
Rick Boyd: and I that's when we lost our fourth super bowl

984
01:27:08.800 --> 01:27:14.200
Rick Boyd: and so I I took it on the chin I actually just heard. Never mind, it's another story.

985
01:27:14.200 --> 01:27:33.269
Andy Miller III: Well, well, Fran Tartington wasn't exactly the rk, Goss, but is close to it. Well, Rick, thanks so much for your time for your passion for the word. And look for if you want more of this, check us out at Wesley Biblical Seminary, and even if you audit a class. Learn the inductive Bible study method. Means a lot to me, Ricky. Take time for us today.

986
01:27:33.520 --> 01:27:34.400
Rick Boyd: Thank you, brother.